Alain Prost is the latest in a long series of racing people to remark on the wisdom – or otherwise – of Michael Schumacher’s Formula 1 comeback. Schumacher fans continue to believe that Michael will get up to speed in 2011, although there is no logical reason for this to be the case, unless the car is specifically designed to meet his tastes. Having said that, Prost made the point that Michael’s greatest strength used to be the ease with which he could adapted to different machinery, which would seem to suggest that the Frenchman believes that Michael is simply too old.
“For me, it’s just a question of age,” Prost told L’Equipe. “I think the tyres are just an excuse, because Schumacher always adapted to any sort of car. It’s just not possible to return to the top after being away for three years at that age. It’s a matter of physiology.”
Prost also suggested that Schumacher’s approach to his comeback was wrong, creating unrealistic expectations.
“He should have said he was coming back to help Rosberg, or Mercedes in its first year, or his friend Ross Brawn. It would have been easier for him,” Prost said. “It may have been a lack of humility, but I think he saw himself as more powerful than that.”
There continue to be stories suggesting that Michael will not race in 2011, but will instead take on some role in Mercedes GP Petronas. At the moment there continue to be rumours that there is discontent between the UK and German parts of the team, with the suggestion being that team principal Ross Brawn and Norbert Haug are at odds. These have been denied. One rumour that has been doing the rounds is that Haug might be replaced by Schumacher. This is not really a very credible suggestion as Haug is a survivor the highest order, having held his current position since joining Mercedes-Benz in 1990. Under his leadership Mercedes re-entered F1 and has won a series of titles with McLaren, won the Indianapolis 500 and figured strongly in Indycar racing between 1994 and 2000, collected a number of DTM titles and dominated Formula 3. He also led the company into the FIA GT Championship in 1997 with much success although an attempt to compete with the CLR at Le Mans in 1999 ended in complete disaster with a series of cars flipping resulted in the decision to withdraw from the event. Haug survived that debacle and has managed to be sufficiently politically adept to avoid conflict with the various bosses of Mercedes-Benz and its parent Daimler throughout a 20-year career. He has worked for five different Mercedes-Benz chairmen: Werner Niefer, Helmut Werner, Jurgen Hubbert, Eckhart Cordes and current incumbent Dieter Zetsche.
But no-one would have believed it.
I don’t think one should question the wisdom of Schuie’s comeback so much. If he felt happy doing it (and he appears to be still very relaxed and happy in interviews, themselves something of a novelty) and Mercedes want to pay him then who are we to criticise.
So long as he isn’t a danger to others, which after Hungary this was debatable, but he seems to have reappraised his behaviour since.
I really don’t think he’s struggling as such. He’s just not benefitting from the special circumstances he built for himself previously. No endless testing, no bespoke tyres and no subservient teammate.
If ever a driver handled his comeback perfectly it was Prost. Not as a team-owner though…
I think Schumacher will decide on next year after testing the 2011 Mercedes car. If its competitive then i think he will stick around, if its not then i think his neck problem will come back LOL and we will see Sutil in the other car.
If he does stick around in 2011 i dont think he will win the championship, maybe he could get a few wins…..
Such a shame JV cant get back into F1, i think he is a fast driver, just had crappy cars since leaving Williams.
Would love to see JPM back too…..
Schumacher has harmed his legacy. He was a fantastic driver in some fantastic cars with team mates who were willing (or forced to) play second fiddle.
This time two years ago, he could have made a claim for the title of “The greatest ever F1 driver” and statistically, this is still so, yet Senna, G. Villeneuve, and Stewart still have that aura about them, the mystical sort of demi-godhood that Schumacher has destroyed with his comeback.
In 2005, beating Schumacher meant you had a good weekend.
In 2010, it means you might be in the points. Nothing more.
It’s fair comment to critique Schumacher, but there has been a particularly gleeful indulgence in’schadenfreude’ by some in the press, you especially.
It’s particularly hypocritical when you so often talk about being unable to predict performance or outcomes in the championship. While seemingly being perfectly qualified to explain the exact nature of Schumacher’s failings.
We saw the change from Michelin tyres to Bridgestones had a major impact on the performance of many drivers in 2007. Some, Kimi Raikkonen, never really ever got back on track.
I think with a 3 year lay-off, his advanced years, Schumacher ought to be cut some slack.
Of course we can all look at the combative nature of his previous career and say, wel he has this coming. An ugly English media trait that.
He may or may not ‘turn the corner’ with new tyres. But we’ve as we’ve seen on a couple occasions this season (most recently Suzuka) Schumacher still has it in him to clean Rosberg’s clock .Despite his geriatric years.
Whether Suzuka, like Barcalona is a blip (although isn’t it strange how similar in characteristics the two circuits are, a lot of high speed corners) we wont know. But there’s enough evidence to at least support Schumacher’s ‘excuses’.
He needs to show he can run with Rosberg on the Pirellis. If he can do that, I think he’ll be around next season. And it’d be lovely if he could go one better, and find himself in a position to re-iterate his rather moving post Suzuka 2003 comments.
[...] Joe Saward publicou em seu blog um texto onde Alain Prost, tetra campeão da categoria, fala sobre a volta de Schumacher e os motivos pelos quais ele acha que Michael não conseguiu se adaptar novamente à categoria. [...]
in fairness to your readers, the next time you rant about GMM (without mentioning that name, of course), you should at least admit that you read their news, and indeed that you trust them so much that you use the translated quotes verbatim for your own publication. otherwise, that’s just not fair.
David rowlands
I did not use them.
It is interesting that Rubens is still on the ball and is not much younger than Schumacher, I guess the lesson there is not to stop. I think Prost’s comments are rather funny, essentially, he’s saying that here is further proof of the levels of Schueys arrogance, except this time not so justified. Perhaps this is why he is smiling more during his interviews.
Also, it is clear to see that there is something going on with Ross Brawn, he has tried to sound positive in his interviews, but his face expression and demeanor are there for all to see. Since, as you mentioned Joe, Haug’s job is very secure then the other job is..?
To Aaron,
Why should anyone cut any driver some slack? They are all hired to do the best job possible, especially those that cost millions. Michael hasn’t performed as well as expected this season, and conclusions can be drawn that there are many better drivers out there than him. Mercedes won’t have failed to notice this.
At first I thought the Schumacher return was to boost the team and for him to enjoy a taste of current F1. Certainly to expect him to be an instant front runner was unreasonable. I expected him to be gone with some dignity and replaced by Sutil by now. But the physiology aspects may be more important that we realize. For example getting the neck muscles back into condition to handle the ‘G’ forces especially over the race distance. This may simply require time in a car and there is limited opportunity for practice these days. In his Ferrari period unlimited practice was an essential element in their success. But I sense Schumacher has been getting more competitive and more determined in recent races and could be getting his full condition (and ‘mojo’?) back. It may be that he does intend to give it the full treatment next season, it would be the only reason to persist. If not, surely he would realize it is time to move on.
Schumacher’s advice during Kimi’s tenure at Ferrari was often ill called. And yes, I think the professor is correct. He’s simply to darn old!
@Aaron James: “I think with a 3 year lay-off, his advanced years, Schumacher ought to be cut some slack”. You mean judging him as if he was a rookie??
Your reply reads a if you are one very disappointed Michael Schumacher fan.
yes, you did.
david rowland I see no point in a yes, you did, no you didn’t discussion with you. You don’t know how I operate so I cannot see how you have the gall to make such statements. I may have found the same source material and done the same translation (words can be translated in the same way, you know) but I have a strict policy not to use GMM – on a matter of principle and if you knew anything about my views regarding F1 journalism you would understand this.
@Gilraen, indeed you are correct I am a quite disappointed Michael fan.
But at the same time, I think in reaction to your point, and indeed Steve’s, ‘how should we evaluate Schumacher’s performance’.
Well, first up, has Schumacher fulfilled the promise of winning races? No. Let alone championships. Has he led the team? Well, I can’t speak about behind the scenes, but certainly he has not on the track. Nico certainly has won out.
But could anyone else have done materially better? Perhaps, although we now have to accept Rosberg as a seriously strong benchmark. I’m not sure a rookie driver, nor even a Nick Heidfeld would have performed so much better than Michael has this year.
But is being merely ‘average’ OK for a Michael Schumacher? Well in my opinion no, Michael in order to stay in F1 needs to be better than Rosberg. And, I still believe (and I base this on his performances at circuits like Barca, and Suzuka) he has it in him to do so.
BUT, he HAS to take off straight away on the Pirellis. It will effectively be a clean sheet between him and Rosberg. And Michael has to demonstrate he can adapt to them and show Nico the way.
I think the break he had, the challenges with the lack of testing, and of course so little experience with the tyres has put Michael at a disadvantage. One Nico has used to put clear space between them.
My main point though, is that some in the media, are lining up to take a whack at Michael. They think it is perhaps deserved because of the way they perceived his previous conduct or the way they felt he treated the media itself. He’s a tough man, he can take it. But it doesn’t make some of the criticism levelled at Michael any more meritorious or correct.
I mean for an example of how fickle some of the commentary is one only has to look at that class a clown Eddie Jordan… And Joe, for better or worse, has appeared to apply selective criteria in his criticism of Michael, while choosing to keep schtumm on other drivers failings. This is fine too, Michael generates hits and reaction (look at this damn post!).
But, we have to accept then, that Michael is getting a pretty hard time of it, and perhaps more than he deserves, from some quarters of the press.
I disagree with Prost’s take mostly and while just blaming the tires is indeed an excuse, it does point to a primary truth about Schumacher’s comeback: his past success came about in part because he was flattered by his machinery and iron-clad #1 status in multiple teams. Every aspect of his Ferrari years was molded around him — tires were engineered to his liking, teammates forced to agree to not to try to beat him, and one benefit that I think has been grossly under-appreciated is that Luca Badoer knew exactly, precisely how Michael liked his Ferraris handling set up to be and had unfettered testing access to the Fiorano test track and pounded out lap after lap, all to aid Michael’s success. Schumacher’s now back in the same situation as year one with Benetton or Ferrari and with the current testing regulations, in the absence of machinery or a teammate that flatters him, Schumacher appears as he really is: average, good not great, unable like so many drivers now and before him to break out of mid-pack and get to the pointy end of the grid.
Schumacher was always a cheater, Mercedes GP playing a fair game and the old “champ”(?) is cheatless – oh… I mean “chanceless”. He was never as good as Lauda, Senna, Prost, Hakkinen and the rest. Schumacher is a born cheater, great to see him punished. He blame the tyres or suspension or whatever. No it is not the car nor is it the rubber. The problem is between the steering wheel and the seat.
The fact is that Schumacher is old and slow, beaten fair and square by Nico Rosberg. Schumacher could stay for another year just to give me one more joy of seeing the old cheat getting beaten up.
The only part left of the “old Schumacher” is the unfair manners and poor sportsmanship, good he did not kill Rubens..
Schumacher as average as he always was…
I don’t understand why Michael doesn’t just do what other aging athletes around the world do (especially in the good old United States) ……. take performance enhancing drugs. In a few months he could have neck muscles like the Inredible Hulk and stamina like, oh, I don’t know, maybe Lance Armstrong and Alberto Contador. Perhaps the man so many love to hate actually has stronger ethics than we thought.
For me it is not simply a problem of age or having a three year break. To me the issue is that he is now in a very different situation to previously. As has been mentioned elsewhere everything at Ferrari revolved round him. The car was designed to his requirements and he had a million hours of testing to hone it. Bridgestone made tyres to suit his driving style so he had custom made tyres while everyone else had off the peg items. That is why McLaren switched to Michelin.
In effect in the 5 championship seasons he had at Ferrari he was in a different situation to any other driver.
We also had different rules in place. Schumacher has never been anything special in traffic. In many cases he has been verging on useless. Before we had re-fuelling so all he had to do was drive flat out and let Ross Brawn find him an empty piece of track to do it on. One year at Imola he went from 12th to 2nd and only overtook one car on the track.
As a result of the way he won at Ferrari he has not learned a lot of the things previous generations of drivers did when older drivers could beat younger ones using experience and looking after their cars. Schumacher only ever learned to drive flat out so once the edge dropped off his speed he had nothing else to rely on. Now he does not have the speed and has to gain places in traffic so he is lost.
All we have heard from the team is that the car doesn’t suit him but this was supposed to be the driver who could get into any car regardless how it handled and be fast so you have to wonder why he has down so pathetically badly against Rosberg.
Aaron says we have to accept Rosberg as a seriously strong benchmark. Why? If we assume Schumacher is much slower than any of us expected how can you conclude that Rosberg must be particularly good to beat someone who is nowhere near his peak?
[...] Michael Schumacher still be around to race with his F1 comrades in Russia in 2014? Alain Prost hopes not. Prost is less than impressed with the return to F1 this season by fellow legend Schumacher. The [...]
Another excellent opportunity to take a stab at Schumacher. Entirely fact-free (unless you take the commentes of someone who has never said anything nice about anything/anyone as facts). From what I hear, the feedback from the team is extremely positive on Schumacher, as his technical knowledge and feedback is exceptional (unlike Rosberg’s).
Joe, why not give up for now, let all those tempting opportunities pass for now and pick up again next year? Does he owe you money, or something?
Stefanos,
There is one fact that you have forgotten: who is the mechanical engineer? Rosberg or Schumacher? Otherwise, I have nothing to say. If you want to live in the past, you are entitled to do so.
I’m neither a fan nor critic of Schumacher – completely ambivalent. What I would like to know is what type of development can be done during races this year towards the 2011 car? Is it minimal? If so, then the old man has been getting spanked Rosberg – with hints of his past in races like Suzuka. If its substantial, then it would be interesting to see what happens next year as one would hope that both drivers were actually driving the same car AND really giving it a go.
Joe – can you shed some light on the level of development that can be done during a race in 2010 that will benefit Merc in 2011 or is that all smoke and mirror (i.e. could his results be attributed to work being done for next year’s car?).
Would be nice to get a sensible discussion around that as its been stated here and on other sites that he’s developing next year’s car – but without any in depth comment.
Cheers!
Mercedes has at least allowed Nico Rosberg to beat Schumacher which shows they have more sporting spirit than Ferrari. But I am still amazed at the amount of money, time they have wasted buying and running their own team, and the team they own is paying 20 million pounds a year for a driver who simply is not quick enough any more. It does not matter that they say the teams “sponsors” are paying Schumacher 20 million pounds to have his doors blown off by a kid who is being paid 5 million pounds. The team could invest that 15 million in making the slow car faster which is better for the sponsors and the team all year and when new contracts are drawn up. They supply the best engine in F1 to McLaren who are giving them “a bath” every weekend. Modern history has proved manufacturers of mass market cars rarely run modern F1 teams well. The “Brawn team” car of 2010 was never going to be as dominant as 2009. The 2009 Brawn design was a one off technical jump that the well run teams caught up with in less than 10 months. Jensen Button knew it and jumped at the perfect time after being treated shabbily. If Mercedes were smart they would have supported a second elite team like Red Bull with engine technology in 2010. Rather than waste millions on a whole team that had no real chance of success. I am not surprised at all that there is reports of an internal conflict between Mercedes people and “Brawn team” people. The culture of a corporation will conflict with the culture of a successful F1 racing team. It will end in expensive , unsuccessful tears.
As for Schumacher he WAS a fast, dedicated driver who took fitness to new levels in the sport and with Brawn and Todt turned around Ferrari, though sadly he was not always a great champion. Great champions never accept charity wins from team mates or any of the many other poor sportsmanship displays we saw him tarnish the sport with. He is now hurting his remaining legacy by not learning to let go. Willi Weber should advise him to retire due to a “neck injury” this Christmas to salvage what legacy remains in Germany. He can create more value for the Merc brand doing TV ads like the great one driving through the tunnel. But another year being thrashed by a young teammate in a mediocre car may reduce his value as a commercial commodity in future.
[...] Is it fair comment or Schumacher-bashing? Alain Prost is the latest in a long series of racing people to remark on the wisdom – or otherwise – of [...] [...]
One gets the impression Schumi haters/ElFraud fans and the like are not exactly happy souls (how dare the krout come back for a go at his second billion quid etc, etc) but perhaps they should try and come to terms with some hard facts of life: The Fangio Era lasted from the mid-fities until 2003, and since 2003 we are simply set to remain in The Schumacher Era until someone wins 8 WDC’s and then that someone could well be MS so no problemo whatsoever.
Lon,
Your a buffon for mentioning Lance Armstrong in the same sentence with Alberto Contador and performance enhancing drugs. As a teenager Lance was tested at the Cooper Institute with the highest Oxygen uptake ever to date of any teenager and I believe adults at that time. I believe his numbers remain the highest ever tested at the Cooper Institute. Lance never was tested positive despite hundreds of tests. Has a work ethic that is unique and has demonstrated the ability to compete pretty evenly with some of the best cyclist in the world even at an advanced age.
Lon you are truly a pathetic sort to believe
that Lance Armstrong’s success and extraordinary accomplishments are anything but achieved by a dedication and drive that few have ever demonstrated in any sport.
[...] Source: http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2010/10/19/is-it-fair-comment-or-schumacher-bashing/ [...]
As per Michael Schumacher: the fellow also has dedication and drive that is exceptional. He will immediately know where he ranks with the new car and tires next spring. His lap times compared to Nico will let him know whether it is time to spend longer breakfasts with his family on weekends or drive another year in pursuit of podium finishes. Time will tell. One thing is certain, Schumacher will be in the best shape of his life when he starts next season.
david rowlands, if GMM and Joe start with the same quote in French (taken from L’Equipe as stated above), they’re always going to end up with an (almost) verbatim quote when translated into English.
My opinion has always been that Schumacher shouldn’t have returned. The likelihood of a perfmance similar to this year or worse was quite high even if it was only car-related rather than driver-related.
Of his driving this year, we’ve seen a few moments of his talent shine through but also a few times we’ve seen his reactions under pressure. If you look back at Schumacher’s mistakes in his initial career run, they were predominantly when he was under a large amount of pressure on the track (e.g. Adelaide 1994 where he ran off the track).
Is Schumacher one of the greats or someone flattered by the car? Well, a bit of both but the latter shows the former is at least a little true as well. Being in the right place at the right time is all part of being a great driver. In history, many drivers have had the talent but not the car, the car but not the talent or changed teams at just the wrong moment. Fangio was a master of being in the right car at the right time and yet no one questions his skills. The difference for Schumacher was that he helped build Ferrari into a team that was capable of building a dominant car.
To get back on track slightly as for the bias some see in Joe’s reporting regarding Schumacher, of all of the drivers in the field he has not met expectations the most (horrible sentence, I know). Looking at the top 5 in the championship, apart from the odd race here and there, they’ve all met or exceeded expectations this year. It can be argued Pedro de la Rosa didn’t meet expectations, but that would depend on whose expectations you were looking at.
[...] Source: http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2010/10/19/is-it-fair-comment-or-schumacher-bashing/ [...]
Has anybody considered that schuey was probably bored out of his brain with retirement,and wanted simply to keep doing what hes been doing since he was a child? Give the guy a break. It must be infinitely more exciting than serving on some charity committee!
neil morrison,
Of course we have considered this. This is part of the story. This is up to him. It damages his reputation, but that is up to him.
There are many compensations to growing old, the acquisition of wisdom not necessarily being one of them (such as knowing when to quit, or perhaps rather knowing when not to stage a comeback) however being faster – or even as fast as one used to be – is not in my experience one of them. That being said, I admire him for having a go, even if it will end in further humiliation, and cannot help but admire him for being so reckless with his reputation. I am sure many more former F1 drivers would make similar returns given the chance, and, as you more or less say, its all part of the adventure story (soap opera) of F1.
On the other hand I cannot help but be reminded of WC’ Fields maxim, “if at first you don’t succeed, give up, there’s no point in being a damn fool!”
Of course, it is not Schumacher-bashing, it’s just an opinion. He was a great driver and I used to be his fan but this year something has gone wrong. In my opinion, he should wait until Pirelli tyre test in Abu Dhabi, see how it goes and make a sensible decision after that. There is no reason for him to go on struggling like this. There are many drivers who deserve the seat at Mercedes more, see di Resta, Kovalainen or Sutil.
And I don’t understand why some people see criticism of some driver or particular action as ‘bashing’. If I say that I don’t like what Alonso did in German GP 2010, it doesn’t mean that I have no respect for his achievements in F1. And even though I think that Schumacher’s comeback was not a great idea, I still think he is one of the greatest drivers in F1 history but you just cannot put Jackie Stewart in a Ferrari F10 today and hope he will set new lap records.
I don’t know anything about GMM translations or Lance Armstrong but I do know that F1 teams spend a fortune and have to have the best drivers available. The truth is Schumacher has been trounced by Rosberg pure and simple. As for “cleaning Rosbergs clock in Suzuka” Nico had outqualified him and was running in front of him when his wheel fell off. Hardly convincing stuff.
Mercedes has to have the 2 best drivers available which at the moment would be Rosberg and Kubica assuming Mercedes are not trying to create a German super team then Kubica should be signed as soon as possible. Schumacher gave it a go but hasn’t delivered, it really is as simple as that, historys most cut throat driver should understand that better than anyone else. Past glories count for nothing the stopwatch does not lie.
I love to see him struggling at long last, especially after that number-changing gibberish at the start of the season. Prost is right: he’s so vain he thought he could come back and whip the new boys, and when he didn’t he blames the car, even though Rosberg is beating him in the same machinery. He should never have come back.
Joe,
“Nothing to say” isn’t quite what you did, as you have writen quite a lot at the top of this page in the form of a “story” (more than enough, in my opinion). As far as I know, neither of the two is a mechanical engineer (although Rosberg was accepted at Imperial on the same year he was offered a seat at Williams and obviously decided to go into F1 racing). I am not quite clear where this line of thought was going.
Anyway, there isn’t much to be gained from having a disagreement with no facts, so I do suggest that you give it a rest until next year (if you can resist the temptation, that is).
elephino,
Why doyou think Fangio was always in the right car? Do you think the teams with the best car gave it to him out of charity? Any team that could sign him did sign him because he was so good.
It’s also worth noting Fangio didn’t race an F1 car until he was 39 years old and was 46 when he won his last championship. 5 years older than Schumacher is now and still the best driver around at a time when surviving 7 or 8 years in F1 was an achievement.
Mercedes has tremendous shortsightedness in their wet dream of a Great German team building a Great German Car powered by a Great German engine propelling the Greatest German driver to a record 8th WDC. Just imagine the marketing! But this was never on the cards. Nationalism is fine, but what is their plan B should one of their drivers not perform? Answer- They have no plan B. They just assummed Schu would outperform Nico. You have to ask, just how good are their drivers? If Schu has still got the speed, then surely Rosberg must be the next Senna. Who believes that? And if Schu has lost the speed, then really how good is Rosberg?
I’ve been tracking all the qualifying times and grid placings this season and Nico has outqualified Schu 13 times by a total of 5.813 seconds or an average of .447 seconds for each of those 13 races. Schu has outqualified Nico just 3 times for a total of only 0.22 seconds or an average of .073 seconds over those 3 races.
In other words, Rosberg significantly outqualifies Schu repeatedly and when Schu outqualifies Rosberg, it is by a hair.
The supergrid for each is also telling, Rosberg averaging 7.06 on the grid and Schu 10.25.
From a data analysis standpoint, there is no way you can crunch the numbers that are not damning to Schu.
Until Merc gets serious and starts making tough decisions they will never get anywhere.
Joe,
you did take GMM’s translation. Check out the Prost interview in l’Eqipe Mag – from one answer (the “pysiology” quote), GMM changed the order of Prost’s answer. One paragraph by GMM is in a different order to the L’Equipe interview.
So you’re saying YOU deliberately changed the order of Prost’s answer as well?
ted m,
I’m telling you that I did not use GMM. Full stop. End of story.
[...] Source: http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2010/10/19/is-it-fair-comment-or-schumacher-bashing/ [...]