Back in 2004, you may recall, there was much fanfare when it emerged that NASCAR’s sister company, the International Speedway Corporation (ISC), had bought a 676-acre parcel of land in a disused industrial sector of Staten Island, not far from Goethal’s Bridge, which links The island to New Jersey. The intention was to build a speedway to serve the New York metropolitan area. Part of the project was to include the development of a high-end shopping complex in the area, working with real estate company called The Related Companies, owned by Stephen Ross, the owner of the Miami Dolphins, best known for its $1.7 billion redevelopment of the Time Warner Center in Manhattan. The project went wrong when ISC ran into opposition from the local population which did not want to see any more traffic on the island and in 2006 it was announced that ISC was giving up and selling the land to KB Marine for $88 million, nearly $20 million less than it paid. That never actually happened because the company never came up with the money and in December the land was put up for sale again.
Things have not changed much in Staten Island in recent years but there has been a lot of talk about redeveloping the North Shore waterfront, all the way from the celebrated Staten Island Ferry to Mariners Harbor, not far from where the planned speedway was to have been built. The plan calls for several new or refurbished parks along the way, with space for farmers’ markets, performance spaces, yacht harbours, cafes and restaurants. At the same time there has been continued discussions about reviving the old rail links from the ferry along the same route, using light rail or trams. This all makes sense as Staten Island could benefit enormously from better transportation and from a little beautification. Tourists often catch the ferry across the harbour in order to get a cheap view of the Statue of Liberty, but they rarely leave the Staten Island terminal and look around.
The key point in all of this is that such development could result in a speedway being built with fans able to arrive by public transportation. It is interesting therefore to hear today that Bernie Ecclestone’s buddy Ron Walker in Australia is saying that F1 is negotiating for a race on Staten Island… Walker knows exactly what a Grand Prix can do for a rundown neighbourhood, having been around in the days when the suburbs and Albert Park and St Kilda were not at all the boutiquey neighbourhoods they are today.
Wouldn’t it be interesting if F1 could achieve what NASCAR failed to do… in its own backyard.
What a hoot! Snuff the Austin race after it’s underdevelopment and pull the carpet out from under them! Bernie at his best.
Chris Rehm,
I think the plan might be to have two US races…
And with the NYC skyline in the background, as Bernie wanted. It would make sense, when I went to NY we did the cheap view of the statue of liberty and were told staten island had nothing!
Interesting.
I work for a PPP/P3 infrastructure investor and we looked at the plans for the rail scheme a while back.
New York as a state is wary of ‘public private partnership’ infrastructure developments but they have in the last couple of years set up a commission to look more seriously at it, which includes MTA schemes.
Mind you, never mind the railway – every bridge connecting Staten Island to the mainland needs to be replaced within the next 20 years so there’s plenty to build!
Having said that Staten Island must have the most ‘not in my back yard’ electorate in the City, and a ‘State of the Borough’ speech from the mayor lauded such acheivements as introduction of a new automated traffic light on some street, so I wouldn’t hold my breath for a major light rail regen and car racing scheme any time soon!
New Jersey would be my bet, but I’d still LOVE to see then back at Watkins Glen. I am glad I got to see the Indycar GP there before ISC finally put a stop to it.
Would be great though. It is always nice to see new venues for F1. That said I am not convinced that the new tracks are always well designed and often lead to dull racing.
Turkey aside, Tiikke hasnt designed good tracks, and if you think about it places like Melbourne, Monza, Spa, Interlagos, and Hockenheim retain not just their history, but also a fantastic track for close racing.
But it would be great to see F1 in New York area. If you think about what the tracks have done for desolate areas such as in Abu Dhabi (not that they wouldnt have built anything else fantastic there!!), and the harbour areas in valencia and singapore, then F1 has helped develop cities.
Bring F1 to Belfast Bernie!
as a new yorker, i can’t see this ever happening. there is no doubt a need for infrastructure and public transit investment on staten island, their rail service is sadly lacking.
however, staten island is less a part of new york city than it is a suburb of it, and staten islanders like it that way. any sort of scheme that involves bringing huge numbers of non-residents into the borough and creating traffic and noise will be massively resisted.
i actually like the idea of redeveloping that portion of the island and revamping unused rail rights-of-way into public transit, but i don’t see how this can happen.
and keep in mind that the only way to access staten island using public transportation is via a ferry from manhattan or bus from new jersey or brooklyn. there is no train or subway service to/from staten island.
Joe, in the past you’ve said that Bernie often employs misdirection to help him achieve his goals, and given that he and Ron are good friends could this be Ron putting a cat amongst pigeons on Bernie’s behalf to achieve a different aim, such as reminding the authorities in Melbourne that F1 has other options?
There’s a lot going on with the Fresh Kills Park on Staten Island. It’s a 2,400 acre park on the south west side of Staten Island which has a 30 year development plan. A lot of great thinking is going in to it as the landfill that’s there includes the rubble of the World Trade Center so needless to say the 30 year plan was developed with some emotion in mind. You can read more here: http://projectprojects.com/freshkills-park
I think the biggest road block for F1 and/or Nascar would be environmentalist which has been a challenge even with the Fresh Kills (as it’s essentially sitting on land fill).
You’re quite right about it being a run down area though. I’m from Melbourne but now in NY and I see a lot of similarities between the two areas (i.e. Albert Park/St Kilda and Staten Island).
There’s also a budget crisis in NY state at the moment so the funding would most likely have to be private and as Chris D points out help the current infrastructure.
As a follow up there’s some great information on how they plan to transform Fresh Kills over the next 30 years here:
http://www.nycgovparks.org/sub_your_park/fresh_kills_park/html/fresh_kills_park.html
The City is currently doing a wonderful job transforming Governors Island so a lot of the same people will no doubt be involved.
It’s true, Albert Park was a run-down not nice place to be until F1 turned up, and now it’s been redeveloped a ‘here today gone tomorrow’ politician wants to kick the people that revitalised it out … Typical politician.
Staten island would do well to keep the politicians at arms length.
I tottaly agree with Joe Staten Island could benefit enormously from better transportation and from a little beautification and it would be very interesting to see F1 in NYC. But I reaaally loved it in Indianapolis…watching those F1 cars takin’ that part of the oval was just great, but belongs to the past.
Good try Joe but I think Albert Park and St Kilda were going to thrive with or without the GP. Look at how cities expand over time and how once unfashionable areas close to big cities gradually become desirable and cool. Paddington 25yrs ago was a dump now it’s one of the most expensive suburbs in Sydney yet amazingly there isn’t a Grand Prix here. Hosting a race might be a factor but it’s an insanely expensive way to go about it.
Hayden,
I sincerely believe that it would not have happened without the Grand Prix. I visited Albert Park in about 1985 and it was a total dump.
Maybe but as I said there are far cheaper and better was of revitalising suburbs than pumping $50m a year into an F1 race. Regardless, the biggest problem for the Australian GP is the way it’s funded. The Victorian Govt. & tax payers pick up the tab which is unfair given that all of Australia benefits from the race. After all it’s the Australian GP not the Melbourne GP. $50m is a small amount for the federal govt. to spend on a an event with a 400m+ viewing audience and the generally well educated, higher income demographic that F1 attracts. Perhaps it could be moved to Sydney where the NSW Govt. habitually piss away hundreds of millions on projects that never get implemented! Idiots.
one word:
Never.
Karen Terry and JoeSaward are quite correct IMO.
Neither Albert Park nor StKilda overall would have been transformed any where near as fast or spectacularly from its dumpy past (not that long ago), were it not for the F1 Circus pushing the timeline and fiscal barriers to an epic make-over. The move (stealing) of Australian GP from Adelaide to Melbourne was decisive to the area in its resurrection.
Hayden, your observation is fair, but the degree of transformation in short time for Inner-South-East Melbourne was not just a product of natural socio-economic forces. F1 beneficial forces were involved. Again.. only IMO, and an Aust. local.
This is where Sydney should get off its ass, and take on the possibility of presenting itself as the next Aussie F1 GP host. If Melbourne politicians feel they got all they wanted (benefits) out of a F1 Race for the cost/year it now runs to; perhaps it’s about time another locale took it on for mutual gain?
As a F1 Fan from the very first Adelaide race in 1985 since, I’d hate to see Australia dropping off the F1 Calendar altogether.
On the subject of Staten Island NY developing a F1 track/infrastrucure project; I sort a see this a classic Bernie Ecclestone. Never watch BE hands while he plays the “3 shell game” with Race Contract holders! BE is an old Jedi Master at distraction. LOL
Albert Park has always been an upmaket suburb St kilda has always been bohemian but real estate has always been expensive and cosmopolitan
Albert Park was used as a public tip for many years and trees and plants died after being planted on the contaminated ground, and they had to dredge the lake in the early 90s because it was contaminated and largely lifeless.
Only after the F1 GP was announced did work start on the replacement of outdated sports buildings, play areas, tree planting, the building of the Lakeside Oval and the Harry Trott Oval recreational areas, and the refurbishment of the childrens’ adventure playground.
F1 isn’t a glowing saviour, but it provided the impetus for regeneration, as it could and would do in Staten Island and similar locations.
A lot of people in Melbourne don’t understand what the Grand Prix does for the city, and they have no idea that other cities think it is worth paying for. I think the race is finished and Melbourne will slip further into obscurity. Pity, as it’s a bloody good place.
As an American and a former NYer, I agree with “Jonathan” : NEVER.
F1 won’t even get close to first base. This story is so lame, it doesn’t even qualify as a red herring. I’m surprised a journalist as savvy as Joe even bothered to post it.
That’s not to say a sports venue is out of the question for Staten Island. The Nets are moving to Brooklyn; the US Open had the opportunity to leave the area in 1978 but merely moved down the road 2 miles from Forest Hills to Flushing Meadows Corona Park (ironically, also a former garbage dump, also a run-down slum). It CAN be done, but 100% of the NYC municipal governments are too financially prudent (some would say “greedy”) to do a deal as terrible as the laughable F1 “money pit” deal.
In simple terms, any potential deal will have to guarantee profitability for the municipality in perpetuity. Zero chance in F1, as Bernie keeps all the money.
Prokhorov only got the Nets deal done by spreading tens of millions in bribes around, agreeing to assume crushing financial risk for the life of the deal, and agreeing to pay approximately 400% more for the stadium than the construction is worth (the area is the most heavily unionized in the US, you must pay 10 people to do the job of one). The USTA took a similar bath on the Billie Jean King National Tennis Center. USTA spent hundreds of millions more than the place should have cost, their horrible deal entitles them to use their own facility only 3 weeks a year, and the US Open is the only “major” without a retractable stadium roof (Note – rain has forced a Monday mens final for the last 3 years running).
Unlike Singapore, Turkey, Abu Dhabi, India, and other assorted “emerging markets” in need of legitimacy and TV exposure, NY needs the publicity and TV exposure F1 offers like a hole in the head.
JBUSA.
Why is that you Americans are alway so negative about these things. Why don’t people look at this as an opportunity? Is this still the Land of Opportunity?
JoeSaward, yes this is still the Land Of Opportunity. But unfortunately F1 does not represent an opportunity to NYC. Simply put, F1 does not bring to the table an opportunity for anybody to make a boatload of money other than Bernie himself (or CVC, or whomever currently owns the F1 Money Machine).
NYC remains the ultimate bastion of pure capitalism. John Paulson made 5x more money in September of ’08 than Bernie has earned his entire career. In 2010, Paulson did the same thing once again, betting on the markets going in the other direction. Bernie’s eye-popping wealth is a joke in that league. Won’t even get him a decent table at a top restaurant.
JBUSA,
If it remains the bastion of pure capitalism, then the race will happen because F1 brings a lot of money into a city. Anyway, my view is that being positive is better than being negative. If you start out saying no, how much progress are you going to make.
Joe,
If this NY race happens, are you thinking they might pair Austin with Brazil and NY with Montreal…or maybe put them all together to make for one much bigger North & South American flyaway trip?
Wood,
I think you may be a little ahead of yourself on this one…
Ahead of myself, Joe? Why? My question was conditional upon the deal for a NY race gaining acceptance, not an assumption that it would.
If you don’t know or don’t have a feeling for that at this time, I understand.
Joe,
Here is my theory: the Events trust fund in Texas mandates that the event was secured by Texas through a “highly competitive bidding process.” The point is to get the event that would have gone to another state. Since F1 has announced a ten year stay in Austin, it doesn’t really qualify as an event that would have been held somewhere else. We certainly didn’t get into a bidding war with other states.
My guess is that you will start to see F1 in talks with multiple US venues, as to give the appearance that Texas is bidding against other states to secure the event. If the event were to be held in another city and Austin, F1 would no longer be eligible to get funds from the trust fund. Conspiracy theory or Ecclestone’s m.o. of smoke and mirrors? You decide…
Actually, Jim, other cities were trying very hard to attract F1 to their cities at the same time Hellmund was working to do the same for Austin. They just didn’t work any more publicly than Hellmund did. Remember, the Austin deal was a major revelation.
Also, you wrote that “The point is to get the event that would have gone to another state.” That’s not the point of the METF. The point is to attract events that will infuse money into the Texas economy from outside the state. It doesn’t if it comes from California or Abu Dhabi, and it doesn’t matter if we’re competing with Monticello, Staten Island, Miami, Indy, Rome, or Russia.
Frankly, if the new USGP is a success, and I believe it will be, I’ll be more surprised if there ISN’T a second U.S. race than if there IS one.
Tim Wood,
Good God! An American who is not saying how impossible it all is… Are you feeling all right?
LOL, Joe…
There are actually a lot more of us than doubters. It’s just that most are too busy getting things done to have the time to post on the internet about the virtues of bringing F1 or other ventures to this or any other area.
My work, however, allows me to indulge in my hobby. Hopefully someday I may turn it into more than a hobby.
the park area itself was certainly refurbished as part of the arrival of f1, but the idea that the surrounding suburbs were transformed by the grand prix is the stupidest single thing i have read on the internet in the last year. these are expensive suburbs close to the city and their values were already accelerating through the stratosphere when f1 arrived. they are populated by the professional classes, exactly as they would have been if there had been no GP. i have yet to meet a resident of these areas who finds the annual GP anything but unpleasant, so this certainly isn’t anything to do with prices going up. the residential areas look essentially unchanged in appearance, and the commercial areas probably have about the amount of development you’d expect from 20 years of gentrification. maybe some of you idiots would like to explain how the grand prix has single-handedly caused the almost identical transformation of Carlton or Richmond (nowhere near the track, for those non-melbourne readers who mistakenly came here looking for information) over the same period … as opposed to the widespread phenomenon of inner suburbs previously used as cheap housing for students being taken over by the professional classes moving back towards the city