The Formula 1 world becomes ever more bizarre. It seems that Red Bull Racing is going to have to go (on bended knee) to Renault in order to have engines in 2016. The Milton Keynes team terminated its 2016 Renault contract in July, convinced that finding another engine would not be that hard. Since then the team has been told to “bog off” by Mercedes (at Spa) and more recently by Ferrari. Neither manufacturer wants to deal with the team, which has a reputation for criticising its partners. With Honda having made it clear that there are no engines available for Red Bull, the only choice for the team is to go back to Renault. Fortunately, Renault might be willing to accept the situation because it has been negotiating a nine-year deal with the Formula One group and if Bernie Ecclestone “asks” to Renault to help out Red Bull, it would be wise for Renault to agree. This may not be the long-term solution for Red Bull Racing, but beggars cannot be choosers and right now there are no other options. In the longer term, there may be solutions involving other manufacturers (particularly if Red Bull is willing to pay to help development). We will have to see what develops…
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joeblogsf1 
Do you think there will be any trace of Infiniti this time?
I read somewhere the Arrivabene agreed to give RedBull + Toro Rosso 2016 Ferrari engines.
Well, it was offered…
So why did it not go through? As RBR were holding out for those, it can only be a demand for the same fuels, etc., that made Ferarri withdraw.
Red Bull turned down a 2016-specification Ferrari power unit supply deal for both of their teams? Why would they do that?
The implications of this as to the business acumen and arrogance of Redbull is astounding. I bet Mark Webber’s having a right laugh, as well as the rest of the F1 paddock. Red Bull’s a laughing stock. Takes the pressure off Honda – momentarily.
I’m finding this one of the most enjoyable aspects of the 2015 season.
There has to be much more behind this, it was crystal clear from the very beginning that RBR had no option but Renault for the next year or two. Mateschitz proved he’s a billionaire, but not a true one in the corporate game.
Tall order to get Ghosn to agree to this after his speech at the Frankfurt motor show, where he said that Renault under no circumstances would continue as engine suppliers to third parties. If I were in charge at Renault, I would demand Horner being fired and Marko being permanently muzzled in order to even consider agreeing.
However, I wonder where this would leave Infiniti and Total as presumably their agreements with RBR were cancelled too ? Assumed that they would migrate to the Renault works team come what may – if indeed there would be a works team in this case.
Any insight on that, Joe ?
If he wants historic money I am sure he will agree
I’m sure you’re right.
My concern is that I’m wondering if he does actually want that, or at least whether the amount he’s being offered is anywhere near enough to interest him.
It looks to me as if he’s deliberately stringing BE & RBR along, and that the only reason he isn’t walking away and making it clear that he’s not interested is because he’s hoping to be offered a -much- better deal if he can keep them at the table long enough for them to run out of alternatives.
Assuming no deal is reached, I’m sure that someone will provide RBR some kind of engine rather than actually see them unable to line up on the grid. Lotus on the other hand I think are in fairly deep trouble at this point; I still think the Renault Plan A is a bargain priced purchase of RBR under distressed sale conditions, Plan B is exit and Plan C is to buy Lotus -if- BE offers them a much better deal than anything he’s come up with so far.
Hope I’m completely wrong.
If there is a racing god in his heaven he will make RB accept Renault’s 2015 engines. Or if Renault have any latitude (absent Bernie leaning on them) they will structure the engine deal that way.
I’m sure Renault/Lotus will not want to risk getting outpointed by RB using their own engines. Take a page out of Ferrari’s response Renault; tell RB to take the 2015 engine package or bugger off!
Or rapidly develop that abandoned Cosworth engine.
Wouldn’t it be interesting if Red Bull gets a mediocre Renault engine and Torro Rosso gets the quite good 2015 Ferrari?
So Toro Rosso can outqualify the Red Bulls? Yeah, that would be hilarious… oh wait…
“I don’t want this engine anymore, it’s rubbish. Take it away, and we’ll have a better one instead!”
“If I can’t have the best engine available I’m taking my toys out of the game, and I’ll find a different game for my staff (who’ve chosen to work long and hard to carve a career in F1…) to play instead!”
“No we don’t want your second best engine, we absolutely insist on removing the ones from your own race cars, thank you. Otherwise we’re not playing!”
“I’ll scweam and scweam and scweam until I get what I want!!!
And if I don’t get it, I don’t want to play anymore!”
“Five hundred million you say?”
“Er, so you won’t give us any engines at all now?
Not even those old ones lying out the back?”
“Oh”
“Erm. Do you actually mind if we continue to use these fine engines for another year after all, while we work on procuring/building another one please?
Pretty please?”
Excellent analysis!
Hilarious. Doubtless, others before me will have posited that Red Bull won’t be getting the same PU that the Renault team will be using.
Since Lotus is becoming the Renault works team it would seem only appropriate to supply Red Bull with a B spec engine, similar to the arrangement Mercedes has with its customers.
After Red Bulls behaviour in recent seasons isn’t it wonderful to see them not only fail to get what they want but also being forced to swallow their pride and back down?
Hopefully something is sorted out (for the sake of the staff of both teams) but the owner and management are getting exactly what they deserve.
Ha ha ha ha ………. Insert multiple ha ha’s here
Egg on face. I enjoy this more than the racing! Well, some of the nonracing.
If ever there was a definition of hubris it’s got to be this whole mess that Redbull have gotten themselves into.
The divorce papers are on the kitchen table, but not signed, so there is still room for Renault and Red Bull to talk about it. Renault is playing some sort of brinkmanship here with the engine tokens, not using any until now. What’s that all about?
Dietrich believed he had a deal with Lauda for Mercedes PU, but it seems Lauda doesn’t have the juice or power that we think he has, and Wolff and the main broad over ruled him. Hence maybe that is why Red Bull were so vocal in their dealings about the Renault PU
If one looks back at the CCB fund and why Red Bull was included in it, you need to remember that Dietrich has been in F1 since 1995 as a sponsor, before becoming a team owner. So motorsports is a platform that works for them to sell – leverage the brand around the world. Part of the deal I think was that they used Renault PU and they played that card that Renault had been in F1 a long time since 1980 and before. It was the same sort of trick that Mercedes used to get into this “Club”, now if Renault want to acquire a team in their own right then they think – rightly or wrongly that they should be in the CCB Club as a nice full member, which then brings in the question about Red Bull and why are they still in the Club?
I wonder if another game is been played here, that with Red Bull pulling out due to lack of Engine, that they think the value of FOM will drop and maybe Dietrich, Bernie & McKenzie would then acquire a majority holding in the sport. Or given that Red Bull likes to own their sports – so to speak, and given that we seem to be losing a lot of our old Heritage tracks, which Red Bull could in theory set up their own Motor racing series, using these old tracks, that can’t afford Bernie’s prices.
There is a lot going on behind the scenes right now, and I think a lot of what we see, sort of implies that something bigger is a foot, than just a simple engine deal. We are of course talking about F1 and here we talk in the many millions – billions, so big winners and losers.
I can’t see Bernie and the CCB going after Dietrich for walking away from F1, there is the small problem of the EU looking into F1, and what sort of security did Dietrich put up – nothing most likely, and this is of course F1 and contracts don’t seem or appear to carry the same sort of weight that they would do in the “Real” world………
Lauda said in various interviews that he didn’t have the authority to offer Mercedes power trains, and that he simply listened to the request and took it to the board. He then says there was never a formal request from Red Bull.
If I were Lauda I would definitely have told Red Bull that I couldn’t guarantee anything but that I’d do everything in my power to ensure a good deal for good engines.
Then I’d have sat with the Mercedes board and said “I’ve convinced one of our main rivals to commit sporting suicide, and all it’ll take is for you to quietly but firmly over-rule me on the issue of supplying them engines”.
Finally I’d sit out on my balcony somewhere pleasant, drinking a fine glass of wine and probably treating myself to a good cigar with a cheeky little smirk on my face. I might even invite my friend Toto over to join me to laugh about how naïve some people can be.
Donald Mckenzie can’t be an equity participant in the purchase of FOM: he is managing partner of CVC’s stake in FOM. That is a clear conflict of interest, and one for which CVC would be sued by its investors, particularly if there is a case to be made that McKenzie participated in a scheme with the acquiring consortium (McKenzie, DM, BE) to drive down the value of the business.
He retires in March 2017…
“…and Wolff and the main broad over ruled him.”
Perhaps an unfortunate reference to Susie Wolff 😉
Lots of people have been playing games and the Renault engine is not as weak as some protest. Red Bull have been at the high table of F1 for a number of years, long enough for them to argue for less prescriptive F1 rules where engine power is a less important part of the car package. If things aren’t working for them at the moment, they should consider their own contributions to the rule making process.
Renault, of course, can now adopt the moral high ground by offering engines to Red Bull. Red Bull have had their noses rubbed. The team might find this uncomfortable but they would have a choice.
It couldn’t happen to a more deserving bunch of petulant ingrates. Frankly, I hope they get year old Renaults. Why? Because they deserve it, that’s why. Having read your previous blog, I am for once grateful for Mr.Eclestone’s $500,000.000.00get out clause. Speaking of clause, Bernie’s starting to look like Santa Clause and Manteschitz, Horner, and Marko are a trio of Grinch’s!
Ha ha… was waiting for that to happen…
This is an even more bizarre situation than the Lotus vs Lotus case a few years ago that ultimately resulted in having no actual Lotus cars on the grid.
Oh to be a fly on the wall when Horner goes to visit Cyril Arbytol! 😀
What ever happened to the Craig Pollock engine factory?
Red-bull came with the drinks to gate crash the F1 party, were popular and made lots of friends but after a good time and too much success started believing their own hype and as usual with too much booze said a few nasty things about their new best-ests friends and are now regretting it (but only because they were caught out)….
“Be careful what you wish for” or “Treat others as you would like to be tret”.
They won’t be missed or even fondly remembered. Shame for the staff though.
this article needs to be set to music . elton john’s “sorry seems to be the hardest word”
Hi Joe,
Loving the blog right now so thank you!
Every so often I read someone saying something like: “why don’t RB just build their own engine!”.
Now, I know full well they’re very unlikely to and I guess main reason is cost. However, what actually is that cost? What have
Merc spent? What should Honda/Renault have spent?
My memory suggests Merc have had 400 people on it (just the engine) for 4 years spending what, a hundred mill’ per year?
Thanks!
I would have thought a 2016 Renault would be much the same as a 2015 Ferrari engine, if not worse…
Joe, what is German for “Bog Off”. I am 100% sure that can be fluently said in Brixworth with many subtle nunaces and tones to convey the full meaning of the specific context of the term. Not sure, quite so much, in Stuttgart. I just don’t see the German language being that precise and elegant. Even for Mercedes. Thanks for giving me a great chuckle over that one. Pricless.
A large slice of humble pie is in order,……
The only thing to say is: Wow…
Such a shame that F1 has come to this. The best TEAM (as opposed to engine manufacturer) being forced to either run around the mid-field with one of the best cars in the game, or leave F1 all together.
When is the FIA going to wake up and smell F1’s demise?
There is no such thing as “best team” in F1. The best team is the one doing best on track each year; nothing more, nothing less.
The best chassis and aero department?
Going from the way this potential solution has been stated by James Allen, it sounds like Bernie’s “wriggle room” to save Red Bull, is to jeopardise the plan to save Lotus – eg. backtracking on how much historical CCB money goes to Renault, in order to force them back to the table with Red Bull.
Laughing so hard right now…
I hope Renault fills the new contract with some severe penalty clauses regarding the future public utterances of one H. Marko.
Indeed. I really am mystified as to what DM sees in him, or what photographs lie in someone’s safe somewhere…
I was going to say because they are fellow Austrians, but so is Lauda and I really like Jem’s ‘sporting suicide’ analysis above.
It shall become known as ‘the Helmut Marko STFU clause’
Ha!
I do hope Renault follow Ferrari’s lead and offer a spec behind the works team…..
For me this leaves a big question mark over C. Horner’s competence. If they end up back at Renault then the past few months could of been avoided with better leadership. Now the team are on the back-foot for 2016, and still with a less than idea engine partner.
What RB need is a principal who 100% stands up for the team as a racing entity, even if that means disagreeing with DM and HM, who *don’t* view it that way.
you don’t mean that you thought horner was in charge , do you ?
he does what he is told
That feeling of being initially slightly embarrassed at how strong the “freude” in your schadenfreude is, and then deciding, bugger it, that lot in Fuschl am See deserve it and I’m going to enjoy every minute of it…
There must be a German word for that?
Is there any chance Renault would take over Red Bull instead of Lotus? And maybe Ferrari would take Toro Rosso as a junior team?
Why?
Wouldn’t all of Red Bull’s staff be hostile to the new owners? Compared to the historical Lotus-Renault relationships?
So now they’re going to be a Renault customer! Hahaha
Renault should refuse to give them a 2016 spec engine too!
Joe, what is the mood of the team? Is this a full climb down? All threats have failed, tail between their legs? Or are they spinning and still complaining that it is someone else’s fault?
Hahahahaha! Almost makes me believe in karma.
Could this effect Renault’s proposed purchase of Team Enstone?
I thought that the Red Bull contract termination money was needed to make this happen. Or will this money be found from another pot? Bernie?
!!!!
Very. Good. Point.
Joe?
I think the fee for next years engines will be much much much more than any contract termination money paid. Besides, why should Renault have to pay back the termination fee? This would presumably be a new agreement, with new terms and conditions attached. i.e. RedBull will pay through the nose for an engine and Horner will be contractually obligated to wax lyrical about how good the Renault engine is at every opportunity, even if it just blew up on the first lap.
My understanding is that Renault had not yet received any engine termination fee from Red Bull but had budgeted it towards the money needed to purchase Lotus. Obviously I do not know that for certain.
My feeling is that if Renault supply engines to Red Bull in 2016 then it will be under the existing contract (maybe there will be a extra fee on top (fine!)) but not to the same numbers as would of been raised from any contract termination. I understand from reading Joes blog/Grand Prix+ (which is excellent) that Renault need to justify any Lotus Team to its board. To do this monies raised have to be found outside the exiting company’s sporting budget. They cannot simply write a check.
I might be wrong but I cannot help thinking staying with Red Bull could effect the Lotus Team purchase thus jeopardising this teams future even further.
If it’s to be a new contract, I’d wonder if Renault will push for a specific exclusivity clause regarding other car brands as sponsors – essentially a push to force Red Bull to drop the Infiniti partnership.
That’s what I’d do, but this might be why I don’t run a leading car company.
Infiniti is part of Nissan which is partly owned by Renault so there is no real conflict there.
There used to be 4 car manufacturers logos on the RB (or perhaps it was on the old Alonso Renault?) Renault, lada, infiniti and Nissan
One cannot help but wonder if they could save face and just leave. At least then people would have to believe that their many threats to do so were not empty.
After such overwhelming public humiliation if the do manage to stay, the new team colours should be a dull brown hessian design on the body with grey splotches of ashes thrown on.
Ha! Or the big red bull logos should be skeletonized, with tears running down their cheek bones.
They would need to spend 500 million in order to do that. Not sure Red Bull would spend that kind of money just to quit..
I now have this picture in my head of Ron Howard sharpening his pencil ready to begin a new ‘F1 movie’ script …
If I were Carlos Ghosn(and I am not) I would demand the ouster of Horner and Marko from RedBull as a condition for continuing to supply engines to the team. Then charge an outrageous fee for the engine itself.
Is that cold enough?
No ‘knee-bending’ in this – just ‘arm-twisting’.
BE want RB to stay in F1.
Renault wants an ‘historical’ bonus for doing likewise.
BE will grant the latter if RB gets competitive power-units.
Or maybe BE has the real problem if two major players are ‘forced’ to leave?
Despite all the comments above it’s not clear who will have the last laugh.
If I were Renault, I would demand that the engines be labelled Red Bull (or some other fantasy name not associated with Renault-Nissan) and that any hint of criticism toward Renault would result in immediate termination of all technical support.
I wouldn’t last long in the F1 world, would I?
I can’t help but think that it is a win win for Renault to keep the Red Bull teams next year as it will take time for them to get the Lotus team up to where they want. As Ferrari have proved you can make a good step forward over the winter with the engine plus for all Renault’s troubles their engine over the last 2 years have won as many as Ferrari.
I would have thought that Renault was the more likely choice – adapting next year’s car for Ferrari engines couldn’t be easy at this stage, surely?
It would be even more gorgeous if – somehow – the 2016 Renault engine turned out to be a world-beater but that Renault wouldn’t let them have it past the term of their original contract, forcing them to use something else again in 2017…
Can’t help thinking that it looks increasingly likely that Renault are playing hardball and inviting Red Bull to sell them the team on the cheap. And that they’ve strung out the Lotus talks deliberately with an eye on doing that.
And that they don’t need to play nice with Bernie to safeguard their new nine year deal with FOM. Because they don’t intend to sign that deal.
Every deal I’ve ever been involved with that took this long to come together, never actually happened. And there’ve always been really good reasons why it took so long, but still somehow the outcome was always the same. I think the chances of Renault buying Enstone at this point are slim to none, regardless of what does or doesn’t happen with Red Bull. I hope there’s a Plan B for those guys. I’d put money on Red Bull being on the 2016 grid. I’d put money on Lotus not being.
I find it hard to believe D.M. would pull Red Bull out and force people out of work. Not a sensible thing to do.
If I was B.E. or the powers to be I would give Red Bull engines provided either:
Newey, Horner, or Marko is forced out of F1 for a year………..This would be similar to Williams firing Adam Parr. If you going to mess with the game pay the price….
Memo to Renault finance department from RedBull F1 team:
Sirs,
Please can you review your most recent invoice for F1 engine supply. It lists the goods being sold as ‘de-tuned 2015 base spec engines’ with a per unit price of a quad billion zillion trillion dollars – EACH.
Please rectify this error.
Yours faithfully
RedBull F1
P.S. Thank you for your kind assistance in this matter.
Reply from Renault to RedBull F1 team:
Sirs,
There’s been no error on our part. Pay up or piss off, it’s your choice.
It truly makes no difference to us.
Yours faithfully
Renault
P.S. Thank you for agreeing to pay for our own works F1 team.
— I’m not defending Red Bull here —
I’m still trying to understand how, in a competition which is supposed to take place on a fair and level playing ground and can therefore rightly be called a sport, the engine manufacturers are allowed to offer different specs to different teams, as per the manufacturers’ wishes. Why don’t they also allow Pirelli to give better tyres to the team of their choice? Why don’t they allow Mercedes a lower car weight than other teams because they’re already winning? Unfair money distribution, unfair engine supplies, why don’t they go all the way to a completely rigged shambles? It’s like wrestling, only with added engines.
Why are cyclists allowed different bikes, golfers allowed different clubs, etc.? Head to France around a summer Olympics and the French will probably tell you that the British can only win when they have expensive top-end equipment. To which, because I work in a French engineering company, I tend to reply that the bloody French should learn to make better equipment, but that’s another story.
The teams are free to consult with any other business, the supply of equipment required for their sporting activities. Said businesses can choose, of their own volition, whom to supply and with what specific equipment. It’s a business deal like any other.
Pirelli are told that they must supply the same tyres to everyone because that is the nature of their deal with the central organisation, not with the teams. In the days of the tyre wars, there’s no question that this sort of thing occurred, or at the very least that Bridgestone designed for Ferrari and let everyone simply accept Ferrari’s tastes or go away. That the Michelins were neither tailored to McLaren nor Williams arguably contributed to Ferrari’s dominance with Schumacher.
To say nothing of the fact that when they were being beaten Ferrari whined and got the FIA force Michelin to introduce totally new tires part way through the season!
Joe, casting my mind back, wasn’t there a requirement that engine suppliers be prepared to supply a minimum number of teams? (3 I vaguely remember).
As I understood it, Honda were given a year’s grace / teams looked the other way on that front, could they (according to the rules) be forced to supply Red Bull?
Not sure how enforceable that rule may be in practice…
There used to be
Apologies if this has already been asked, but if Renault do purchase Lotus, and do agree to continue to work with Red Bull in 2016; do you think they be supplying them with customer-spec engines?
It just struck me (and I bet Joe and others in the know thought of this possibility a while ago) maybe the whole public shaming of Renault by Red Bull was a Bernie-like attempt to talk the value of their engine-building business down in order to take it over. Maybe Red Bull’s real hubris was the idea that they could do a better job of building a hybrid power unit than Renault and the way to get control of the business was to throw their 4-times championship winning partners under the bus. If it was then boy, has it backfired.
As someone who has been a fan of Red Bull Racing, I feel the best thing they could do from a fan’s perspective right now is sell the team to someone else, removing Christian Horner and Helmut Marko from the team, and letting the rest of the professionals that work for the team back at Milton Keyes get on with negotiating an engine deal, and with designing competitive race cars.
Joe, could this be a plan all along by the engine manufacturers against Bernie and Red Bull?
The Renault guy must have said to other manufacturers, “look, Bernie will pressure you to supply Red Bull. You firmly say no to them so that Red Bull exit and a grid of less than 20 cars is a real possibility. We will then enter back in the frame and offer to save Red Bull. In return, we will ask for the bonus payment befitting our status in the sport “.
Win-win for manufacturers, Renault get the bonus payment and other manufacturers don’t have to supply Red Bull.
Lose-lose for Bernie and Red Bull. Bernie has to part with more money than he wanted to and Red Bull are left with an egg on their face.
Perhaps this is all part of a Red Bull marketing master plan ?
RB is in F1 and other sports because it wants to portray a ‘cool’ young marketing image for its weird sugar water. What could be more relevant to the 17-21 year old boys who buy its product than temper tantrums, sulking and throwing hissy fits when you can’t get your own way ?
If we hear from the Orange Spice that Horner married that he often refuses to clear up his bedroom and plays video games all night I will not be surprised.
sometimes in life you just have to be prepared to eat humble pie !
Can you imagine if the only engines on offer were 2015 Renault engines?! Pft… you can’t make this up..
RED BULL GIVES YOU WHINGES
This is so funny. With Renault buying Lotus and being a Works team, Red Bull are going to have to beg Renault to be given Renault CUSTOMER engines. Really feels like http://www.taleswithmorals.com/aesop-fable-the-dog-and-the-shadow.htm is relevant –> Greed making someone thinking they can get something better, and they lose the good thing they currently have.
Williams, Mclaren and Red Bull, next season will be interesting the relative positions of these 3 teams due to the 3 different decisions they each made on Power Units. Williams to stay with customer engines of the best Power Unit supplier. Mclaren to move from customer to works status with a new Power Unit supplier. And Red Bull to make the biggest possible mess out of a very strong situation. They had Works status with the most successful PU manufacturer in F1 history. Now because of their actions they are going to be stuck with either customer engines of Renault for the next few years or pull out the sport completely.
Given the progress Honda have made in 8 months, Mclaren Honda will get better and better. 2017 could be very strong. But the difficulty of the situation Mclaren and Honda faced this year. Ron Dennis has given a masterclass in management of how to handle drivers, engine partners and public relations. Mclaren and Ron’s brave decision will only make the team stronger and stronger.
Christian Horner has given a masterclass in how to destroy a position of strength over the past 2 seasons. His dreadful management will see Red Bull get weaker and weaker, (if they are in the sport at all).
2017 will see the Works teams of Mercedes-Mercedes, Ferrari-Ferrari, Renault-Renault and hopefully Mclaren-Honda fighting for the 1st 8 positions. It could be Williams-Mercedes(Customer PU), Red Bull-Renault (Customer PU) fighting for the positions after this. Ron Dennis, Eric Boullier and Jonathan Neale will be so respected for their management ability of managing the PU partnership and making the team stronger. Christian Horner will be mocked for how he destroyed everything that Red Bull had built. Had he offered things like building a Renault factory in Milton Keynes to allow the partnership to work more closely together and setup homes for 100s of Renault engineers to live in Milton Keynes, hire some people from Mercedes, engineer their way back to the front the way Mclaren and Honda are doing, Christian would have been so much more respected. The most important question is, will Ginger Spice stick around with a guy who is not the F1 boss of the dominant team? But instead whose management “skills” single handedly destroyed the existence of the whole team and his whole job in just 2 years after being dominant. Susie Wolff better watch Toto. Ginger will be targeting him next!
2 questions.
1) Can you imagine how Christian would have handled Mclaren-Honda’s situation if he was in charge of it instead of Ron Dennis? He would have been cut up into sushi by Samurai warriors in the middle of the night by now?
2) The head of F1 needs to be the master negotiator, deal maker and arrange complex agreements between teams, power unit manufacturers and sponsors who all want different things. Bernie Ecclestone has been able to excel in this very complex role for 35 years. Given how Christian has managed to destroy the existence of F1’s dominant team in just 2 years, amazing how it was Christian that was being touted as the guy who should succeed Bernie. Don’t think that would be the case now…
I don’t think anyone seriously thought that was a good idea.
You guys realise you’re laughing at the prospect of incredibly good, talented, quick and non-paydriver races like Ricciardo, Verstappen, Sainz and Kyvat being out of a drive next season yeah?
Fair enough, the team behaved like sore losers, but consider that if there’s basically 2 free seats now (Lotus/Renault, and Haas) for 4 talented drivers if Red Bull disappears. I’d assume Ricciardo and Verstappen would be snapped up, leaving Sainz Jr and Kyvat out in the cold.
Joe,
What would be the benefit for Renault to apease Bernie too much at this point in time if we consider that Bernie himself might only have a few years remaining in the sport? Could it only be for more favourable terms for the 9 year agreement? One last benevolent act from Bernie before he departs?
Sack Christian Horner? I suspect there is an unwritten F1 rule that Christian stays at Red Bull in penance for acts committed in a previous existence.
Simon Taylor conducts a monthly interview in MotorSport magazine with a star from the past. When it is Christian Horner’s turn in 20 years for lunch with Simon Taylor, I think history will be on Christian’s side. He’s trying to juggle eight balls in the air and sometimes he looks a fool doing it. But nobody else can do it.
In 20 years Simon will be 153
Simon will turn up, in old (1970s) garb, at yet another historic F1 film.
And we are still waiting for all of the anecdotes from him.
I had no idea he was that old. That’s amazing, he really wears it well.
I’m prepared to bet that he’ll still be driving the Stovebolt Special when he’s 153, though. Respect where it’s due.
This news warms the cockels
Joe,
Both Renault & Red Bull are now saying in public that a deal is more or less impossible, while Red Bull are doubling down on the Renault engine being unacceptable. (So why did you guys actually have a meeting? Just going through the motions to please your rich uncle?)
Red Bull clearly believe there’s still a percentage in playing hardball, and Renault don’t really look bovvered one way or another.
So…do you still think RBR will end up with Renault? And STR with Ferrari (given Marko’s public Tost-slap down the other day)?
And as an aside – if Renault withdraw, Lotus have no engine at all, and won’t get one, because any spare capacity will be diverted to the four RBR / STR cars, correct?
I have no idea what will happen, but I see Renault as a chance, while I see no chance at all with the other three – and there is no other alternative.
Thank you. That’s extremely clear.