Joe, was JB ever considered? After all, he made it clear he wasn’t officially retiring and he left the door slightly open to driving in F1 again. I’m surprised McLaren would let Alonso go when Jenson may have been someone slightly more ‘available’
Joe, notwithstanding your intended conviviality provocativeness, it seems that you may have stumbled on to the truth re MB & Alonso. Beyond the pedestrian or jejune, a deeper analytical assessment as well as a reasonable inference that may be drawn from your post tell us that MB, based on the balance of probabilities, has followed the Ferrari model and pre- signed Alonso to a 2018 pre-contract MOU. This suggest that you may have been prescient indeed re MB & Alonso.
Assuming MB has followed that path and signed Alonso to a pre-contract memorandum of understanding and, ultimately a formal contract they will certainly come to regret such a colossal blunder. Alonso, undoubtedly, is a first rate driver, a notch below Hamilton. – (Alonso a 9 and Hamilton a 10).
However, the record shows that Alonso appears to have been quite disruptive at, at-least three other teams: First: Recall how he berated Renault during his title winning years. Second, recall his behavior at McLaren (2007). Third, recall his behavior at Ferrari. Fourth, recall his behaviour, so far, at McLaren (2016), especially slating the Honda engine during the Japanese grand prix. (BTW: does anyone remember what role Alonso & Pedro de la Rosa may or may not have played in La Affaires re Spy-gate) – Plz share.
Concerning MB & Alonso: The team should think very, very carefully about the wisdom of re-uniting Hamilton & Alonso. These two powder-kegs cannot co-exist in one team. Should Toto & his Elks fail to exercise sagacious managerial judgement; then the joke will most certainly be on them
Comical comment of the year Jeroen.
10 GP wins Lewis
9 GP wins Nico
Over the 4 years Lewis has outclassed Nico by a distance.
So it was a lucky winner this year. Malaysia was the crazy engine failure. Or Lewis would be on 11 wins.
But hats off to Rosberg he got the championship and then it was “Starting Blocks and Reeboks” and a sprint out of F1.
Grab it and Run very odd and Lauda thinks it’s madness too.
No, you’re wrong. Rosberg wasn’t a lucky winner, at least no more so than any of the other thirty-two men who have become world champion. He was simply the winner.
Hamilton never describes himself a lucky winner when he has enjoyed a car advantage for three years like no other in the history of the sport. And that’s despite all his snide comments about Vettel only winning because of the car during his four-year spell, when that car was never close to being as dominant as the Mercedes has been.
Nor does Hamilton ever describe himself as being a lucky winner when he talks about matching Ayrton’s achievements, despite the fact that when Ayrton won the same number of races from the same number of starts he had to do it with a technical failure rate of three times that which Hamilton had.
Nor does Hamilton ever talk about the fact that he has been lucky enough to have the lowest career technical failure rate of any of the world champions. And I do not criticize him for that, why should he talk about his good luck. What I criticize him for is his bemoaning the good luck of others without speaking of all that has favoured himself. If he cannot acknowledge his own good luck, he has no right to complain about the good luck of others. That is hypocritical and unsporting.
No, you’re wrong. Rosberg certainly was lucky, as was his father and a number of other world champions. Perhaps you are a Rosberg fan and don’t like to hear it but that doesn’t stop it being true. Just accept the fact, nothing wrong with being lucky. Even the greats need a bit of luck and fail without it, look at Hamilton this year!
Clearly you see only the parts of a post which you want to see. I qualified the statement that Rosberg wasn’t lucky with “at least no more so than any of the other thirty-two men who have become world champion”, making redundant your attempt to inform of the need for an element of luck to win a title. I also wrote in regard of Hamilton “I do not criticize him for that, why should he talk about his good luck”, negating the requirement for you to inform me that there is nothing wrong with being lucky.
As to the greats needing luck, I did indeed refer to Ayrton’s much higher technical failure rate, albeit that his own is also considerably lower than some others on the list like Clark, Stewart and Lauda.
If you look again at my post in its entirety, you will see that I was not against Hamilton for having luck, I was against him for his attitude towards the luck of others without acknowledging his own good fortune.
And for your information I am not a Rosberg fan, indeed I do not call myself a fan of any particular current driver. Those of whom I would say I have been a fan over the years are Clark, Hill, Andretti and Ayrton, which may indicate to you the team it was which actually held my allegiance.
Clearly you just read what you want to, which negates me even bothering to attempt to discuss with you. Let me try one more time. Everyone needs a bit of luck, some are lucky to win the championship. Rosberg and father are in the 2nd group.
Okay, so I see your idea of a response is to regurgitate the opening of my post and then make irrational and unsubstantiated statements. To be perfectly clear and unequivocal, Rosberg was no luckier this season than Hamilton has been when he has won the title, and that simple truth will not change no matter how long you remain buttsore about it.
As Joe says, calm down. Clearly as can be seen from your use of abusive terms you have lost the argument and resorted to infantile name calling. I’m glad Joe has opted to allow that to be seen by everyone.
So to sum up, some are lucky to be champions, ie the Rosbergs, others are naturally champions, Hamilton, Alonso. They all need luck, some more than others.
It is not infantile to have a broader range of vocabulary which one can bring to bear in order to to suit all occasions, however it most certainly is infantile to refuse to accept that your hero can possibly be beaten without being unfairly deprived of his right to win by some means. Taking it to the length of repeatedly belittling the achievement of the father of the man who beat him, as well as that man himself, shows a childish petulance and failure to understand the working of the world which is quite pathetic to behold.
‘A broad range’ of vocabulary is not enough to hide the truth, at best it can create a distraction for those who are easily led. Becoming a world champion is an amazing achievement, and one that cannot be ‘belittled’. That, nevertheless, does not distract from certain innate truths. Clearly some find these truths uncomfortable. That is not a problem as long as they are also capable of keeping the discussion on a civil level.
I’m not uncomfortable with the truth that Rosberg is the world champion, nor am I uncomfortable with the truth that he deserves to be world champion, nor am I uncomfortable with the truth that he was no luckier to become world champion that the previous holder of that title. There are clearly those who cannot say the same.
It’s often said that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. The repetition of your assertion is falling on deaf ears the whole world over and history will ignore it too.
You are a Rosberg fanboy. You have made that very very clear. It’s lovely and I’m sure he is appreciative. It doesn’t make him Ayrton Senna though, no matter how many times you say he is just as deserving or equally as lucky.
I will say this once and that is it. Calling other people names is not accepted on this site. The term fanboy is unpleasant and designed to be so. If you persist doing this I will stop you. This is supposed to be a civilised place, without trolls. Get the message?
> Damian said: The repetition of your assertion is falling on
> deaf ears the whole world over and history will ignore it too.
IMO, the two of you have been having a repetition contest for some time now. Your claim that Nico’s championship is largely due to luck is no less arbitrary than the claim that it isn’t viz. other champions.
FWIW, it seems to me that Lewis is better than Nico at combat passing and better in the rain. But when it comes to just making the dang car go fast, there’s no real diff between the two of them. Which one is faster depends on the day, the context and last night’s sleep. Head to head with equal reliability, Nico needs a dry race with minimal demands for combat passing. When he gets that, he’s fast as stink. That makes it a toss-up, and either guy can win. I know of no good reason for claiming otherwise.
However, I trust that you disagree… so there’s no real point in repeating yourself yet again ;-0
Yes, Joe, I am familiar with Hamlet, my comment was in respect of the use to which the quote was put. Since his own protestations have been equally frequent, the only inference to be drawn is that by casting me as a female my views become less valid, which is a ridiculous standpoint to take.
Damian: I notice you have repeated your assertion as often as I have mine. Although it is an interesting development for you to suggest that history books will not record Rosberg’s name as champion, because in contrast I do not expect that outcome to change.
As I explained several posts ago, I am not a Rosberg fanboy, I was a supporter of the (original) Lotus team, and a few of their drivers as a direct consequence, and since its tragic demise, which still grieves me, I have enjoyed Formula One as an impartial observer. I am simply reacting to unfair and irrational criticism of Rosberg, who, I am not afraid to state again, has been no more lucky than any previous champion, including Hamilton.
RShack: Your comments are fair. All I would say by explanation with regard to arbitrary claims of luck compared to other champions is that there are tables of statistics analogizing records of all of the champions available on the internet, but I respect, and indeed agree with, Joe’s stance on linking.
Not fair to demote Hamiltons success that year. As a rookie what Hamilton did was incredible, to match the world champion and almost win the title on his debut season is something we may never see repeated for a long time. Unfortunately for Alonso, this was and remains the only season in which his team mate was/would prove to be of a truly world class caliber and his season was far from terrible. For once he found himself with serious competition from the other side of the garage. Ultimately, Hamilton and Alonso will be remembered as the two legends of their generation. All the others including Vettel unfortunately fall slightly short.
I’ll believe it when Merc appoint a driver. if Ferdy isn’t trying to squeeze in there, then he has already given up on being a Grand Prix winner and title contender, as he’s no hope at Mac, during next year….and if Merc put someone in who does a good job and is cheap, and young, then why would they have Ferdy in 2018??
Still think that Ferdy,Vettel & The Honey Badger will be furiously seeking ways out of contracts, and F1 Contracts have never been watertight….the only secure ones were those such as Jackie & Ken had, a shake of the hand and never a thought to break the promise….those times died a longtime back in motorsport!
You don’t think this is just Briatore trying to make himself relevant again? I agree with you that it’s highly unlikely but I’m holding out hope until either Alonso himself says no or Mercedes confirm the second driver.
Just saying I’d take Flavio’s solid denial with a large pinch of salt. I’m sure he is as certain of the situation as anyone who isn’t Toto, Niki or on the board of Mercedes. The rest is just guess work.
Like many of us Joe — only the first words were posted when it opened -that would be those prior to the “NOT” — So we were in the right to question what was ‘posted’ — and BTW, I opened to your site – and only the “I told You So” was in your post….
As just a driver manager, I think Mark Webber’s interview with Lee McKenzie for Channel 4 sums it up perfectly. Mark knows he did a lot to get him established in F1, and he even wanted him to partner Fernando in 2005..
Agree totally.. although i don’t think FA has much choice in the matter. I feel FB has something over him from the past 😦
We all make mistakes.. and i think FA still pays for his ever so slightly in Agent Fees. Just my 2c
This is fantastic, for Alonso, for Mercedes, for F-1, and esp. for fans. Fernando will take take any lip off of Hamilton and it should set a fire back under Alonzo’s rear after some dark days at McLaren. 2017 will be as good as 2016 easily, then through in an improved Ferrari and Red Bull and things are going to get very interesting. Thanks to Mercedes for agreeing to bringing in a top-notch driver for this seat, and for McLaren to allow it (very sporting).
Joe has Alonso himself actually come out and said it isn’t happening? Until we confirmation form Fernando himself either way we should take Flavio’s claims with a pinch of salt. Until Fernando says it won’t happen there is a chance it still might you know then you will have egg on face for speaking too soon.
No but you might be if Alonso goes to Merc. Until Fernando confirms his situation there is always a chance things can happen. You know that as well as I do. Flavio’s comments have not clarified Alonso’s situation at all . A few months before Alonso left Ferrari at the end of 2014 Flavio made similar comments. All may not be as it seems Joe.
I know your hate of Alonso means you’d do anything to dismiss whatever is favorable to him and gives hope and excitement to his fans. However given that you somehow became a well-known figure and a strong voice in F1’s journalism, perhaps you could try and embrace that status by not issuing emotion-driven trolling posts don’t you think? 🙂 Just a thought.
The fact of the matter is both Mercedes and Alonso are very willing to make it happen, however McLaren is not at all willing to release Alonso from his contract, which means the only way Alonso could be signed is if he gets to an agreement with McLaren over the termination of the contract. So a move looks unlikely for now, but can’t be ruled out yet.
As a so-called respected journalist, with so many years in the field service, the Joe Sword view is clearly part of an established international elitist clique existing only to hide truth from the honest taxpayer (and also our future leader).
Until proven different, this is still a story for self investigatization.
Going for a pizza. Where´s ma gun/bible/Breitbart?
As an outside bet I think Alonso really could get this drive – Honda / McL is most likely still a mid grid car next season – he will have an exit clause based on the rubbish performance from the past 2 yrs.
Alonso no doubt would ‘sell his gran mum and dad and his wife’ to get back in a race winning car .
I know someone who was involved in Driver Contracts at two top teams in the recent past. I recall them saying that the minutiae was mindblowing even for legal professionals, and that one team had contracts that ran to several types and also hundreds of pages…..scope for much digging!
Then again, it would have been boring if all the news was about which remaining drivers were in line for Manor and Sauber. At least this gives us something to ponder and Bernie must be rubbing his little hands with glee over the continuing interest in F1 – which would have subsibed until the new season.
Whilst it would normally be sensible to look over there if Flavio says “look over here”, I think on this occasion, he is truthful. I would bet on Wehrlein for a year with options. If he is good, keep him as he is cheap. Otherwise, they go for a big fish in 2018
Brilliant Joe… had a good chuckle over my coffee this morning. In the age of instant gratification, on any other site most people wouldn’t have gone past the headline. On here, most seem to have “got it” first time round 🙂
As part of the Alonso story in a Webber tribute clip they played at the final WEC race Alonso said he was going WEC racing with Porsche in 2018 and it was a pity Webber couldn’t wait for him.Much more likely than Mercedes ever was.
I am so pleased to note your excellent efforts to keep alive some of the older and more subtle forms of humour. I am very disappointed to note that they are wasted on so many of the people who read your blog.
The Christian church is currently in the season of Advent, which is a time of preparation and waiting for the arrival of the Messiah. In that light, I can’t help wondering whether Dietrich Zetsche will send an emissary to announce the new Mercedes driver to a group of shepherds on a hillside somewhere near Bethlehem.
I’ll get my coat …
I don’t doubt your sources but i am curious as to why it’s taking Mercedes so long if they are sure about Pascal W. There’s no contract buyout negotiations. Just Mercedes asking Pascal “hey kid, wanna drive the big silver car? ” and Pascal saying “um… yeah! For sure”. I would think that a quick decision makes Mercedes look strong and confident. Is there someone else tickling their fancy.. (not saying Alonso!) Just my two and a half cents.
I had almost the identical, peculiar, shock feeling reading your tweet headline Joe that I had when I first saw the Rosberg retirement announcement! I’m still hoping for Pascal, Carlos, or Rossi and that Fernando sees through a resurgence at McLaren.
Am a fan of your blog but not the usual self righteous tone then you go do what you accuse the “non race attending” hacks. Click baiting. Would be funny if it wasn’t the case(that you are click baiting).
With the nicest will in the world, if you don’t like it, don’t read it. I am sure there are websites better suited to your level of interest and knowledge of the sport. I try to amuse and inform and if it doesn’t work for you, then that’s life.
I think Button is done as an F1 driver and my honest view is McLaren only kept him because he has such appeal to their “partners” aka sponsors rather than being a race seat option for 2018.
What is also clear is that he will probably peddle something else before stopping driving.
Do you think he has any barrier to going to the WEC? After all there has been a bit of a cull at Weissach and while Mark Webber was excellent for the series generally, having a recent World Champion would be even better With a very real chance to add Le Mans to his CV win list, he could even have a going at the Triple Crown in the future.
I know its speculation, but its based on some comments Jenson himself has made that WEC could happen.
I don’t know how you get on with Paddy Lowe, Joe. But I never warmed to him.
Admittedly that was partly down to blind prejudice on my part, that only people with a good aerodynamics background make good TD’s, and partly that I wasn’t keen on the “wise men” committee approach at McLaren at the time.
Not that what I thought then, or think now, matters a jot.
Some F1 technical bosses are relatively humble, open and approachable some aren’t.