Everyone is watching Paris today to see if the FIA decides to take any further action against Sebastian Vettel, but more important things are happening elsewhere. Sources at Silverstone have tipped off Britain’s biggest vaguely-serious newspaper that Silverstone is going to action the break clause in its British GP contract and bring the race to an end after 2019. Well, that’s the theory. The reality is that this is a negotiating ploy to bring the Formula One group to the table. Given that there are three years before a new British GP promoter is needed, I doubt this will have much impact, indeed it gives the Formula One group the option to shop around. The folks at Silverstone think that they are the only game in town and, to some extent this is true. The Circuit of Wales has blown up in the last few days and I doubt it will ever happen. There is no interest from Donington Park, but there are some possibilities in the London Docklands and I see this being the most likely route for Chase Carey and his gang, with Silverstone as a back-up plan for 2020. That might upset the traditionalists, but imagine a Singapore-style event in stodgy old London. Silverstone is a great event and attracts a big crowd, but it cannot compete with F1 fees as they now are, unless the government helps. Does it make sense for Carey to lower the fees? It is an interesting question. But it will not come to this for a while yet as the British GP remains until at least July (or late June) 2019.
Elsewhere, as expected, there is still no new team principal for Sauber, evidence that F1 is not as easy as some financial types might think.
And there is the question of Jolyon Palmer. For some time there have been rumours that Britain’s other F1 driver may be in danger of losing his seat at Renault, having failed to get close to Nico Hulkenberg on most occasions this year. The implication has long been that the team would stick with Jolyon until the British GP at least, and that still seems to be the case. However the race in Baku was a big setback for the Enstone team, with all its rivals scoring and its goal of being fifth in the Constructors’ Championship beginning to fade. Williams now has twice as many points as Renault and while there are still a lot of races to go, it is clear that the team needs two drivers both capable of scoring points at all races if it is going to beat Team Willy. Chucking out Palmer makes no sense unless there is a clear improvement, so there is little logic to have a Sergey Sirotkin, for example. There’s no time to teach new boys how to do things. The team says Robert Kubica is not a possibility and it is hard to get excited about any of the other options with suitable F1 experience.
So the best option would seem to be to go after a driver from a rival team. There are a few who are unhappy and would like to move on, but who could actually move? McLaren wants to hold on to Fernando Alonso and are not about to give him away, but if offered money might they part with Stoffel Vandoorne? It all seems pretty unlikely. Romain Grosjean could be of interest, but does Haas want to release him? Why would they?
The best option would probably be Carlos Sainz, for a number of reasons. Toro Rosso can always use money (or a reduction in its engine bills). Carlos has been there for three seasons and he has done well, but Red Bull has nowhere to take him, unless Max Verstappen or Daniel Ricciardo departs – and neither is showing any sign of being able to do that. Red Bull has a hungry replacement for Sainz in Pierre Gasly, who is waiting for his F1 chance. Gasly might be an option for Renault, except he has no F1 racing experience and so the only really sensible conclusion is for Renault to go after Sainz. A Renault deal offers him a solid future (which Red Bull cannot) and Toro Rosso/Red Bull has things to gain from letting him go… That, surely, offers the basis for a negotiation.
The option is to leave things as they are and hope they improve, but in this age of team principals as football managers, it might not be wise for Renault’s folk to do that…
We will see.
joeblogsf1 
Maybe Sainz would prefer a car that doesn’t break down?It seems to happen to Palmer on a regular basis.
Yes, I agree with you. But the key point that Renault will be looking at is how he does when it doesn’t break down…
…maybe it doesn’t break down when he drives it carefully……
Commenters were given short shrift when similar comments were made about Hamilton’s reliability woes last year. Interesting that the rules appear different for Palmer.
It’s a joke 😦
I reckon Carlos would be delighted to have a chance at a works team with the budget for steady improvement. Got to be better than remaining stuck in the Red Bull junior team.
The great mystery of F1 economics.
Whose operating expenses (excluding the sanction fee) to execute an F1 event are lower; a purpose-built facility with all infrastructure already in-the-ground, in the middle-of-nowhere, or a yet-to-be-constructed street circuit in greater London? A rhetorical question; no answer required.
Which race is going to bring in greater ticket revenues, a facility that can host 150,000 spectators plus ancillaries such as camping and parking, or a facility that can host at best 80,000? Yes, another rhetorical question.
So, which facility/promoter can afford a higher sanctioning fee? Yes, that’s right, the answer is Silverstone.
And please don’t confuse the economics for a promoter with “exposure” and the perceived “marketing value” of London, as the race promoter receives zero-revenue or benefit from either of these intangibles. FOM can believe they benefit from the intangibles, but they in-turn will need to accept a lower sanction-fee than available even from Silverstone.
That said, I’m sure there will be a disastrous, money-losing boondoggle in Olympic Park that implodes financially after three races and billions invested and lost because this is Formula One.
Excellent comment. If F1 is prepared to lose Silverstone, what chance for Spa, or Suzuka, or some other circuits? And if Silverstone goes, won’t a lot of British F1 fans go too? Didn’t Carey say he wanted more of the historic circuits?
I get what you are saying there Gary. But it is almost certainly not true that a potential promotor would not gain from the exposure or marketing value in the London Docklands, because they are working on the premisis that it would increase property value of (planned) real estate in the area (the same idea that could have made the NJ venue valible).
Sure, Silverstone attracts many fans despite being in the middle of nowhere, offering little but muddy camping grounds for the fans to stay at. But with the combined pull to promote a redeveloped area and a huge amount of “beds” nearby, It is not as easy and one sided a calculation as you present it to be at all.
There certainly is potential, and it will be enough to give FOM a good negotiating position for almost inevitable talks over maintaining Silverstone if nothing comes of the new project.
I think Silverstone’s choice is pretty straight forward to be honest. Break the contract and survive, or keep the contract and run out of money.
Point taken on the Docklands street circuit alternative, but you could say that about all of the races apart from Monaco and Singapore frankly. You could have the best of both worlds and have a Docklands Demo on the Wednesday before the race and then go to Silverstone.
Also, if Silverstone can’t find the money, who in the Docklands is going to be able to? I can’t see property prices there shooting through the roof because of F1 being there.
Going back many years, that was the decision made at Brands Hatch. They chose to survive.
Button usually gets the car home at reasonable speed (except for his contretemps with wehrlein)
He’s not interested
Hi Joe,
On the subject of Button, do you think he’d be interested in a McLaren with a Merc in the back, if Alonso does go somewhere else next year?
I think he’s done with F1
Palmer was very very lucky to get a seat this year, and he hasn’t exactly made the most of his extra chance. Luck hasn’t always been on his side this year, but the sooner he departs the better.
Joe – do you know if there’s any substance to the rumour regarding McLaren being interested in Sainz?
I cannot see why he would go there
Assuming for a moment that either the Honda PU is going to come good (and if they can ‘prove’ it to him) or that they will be getting Mercedes PUs, would it really be such a bad bet on his part?
From what I understand the McLaren chassis is actually pretty good and with a decent PU could be closer towards the sharp end then Torro Rosso.
Not forgetting of course dear old Dr Helmet – will he consider that Sainz has done enough to justify retaining him? From past actions this would only be the case if he can see him one day sitting in the Red Bull – if not, he’s gone sooner or later in favour of the next hot-young-thing.
He’s Spanish, maybe they hope no one would notice the difference!
It’s bizarre how badly Jolyon Palmer has done at Renault. I know that people say he “beat” Kevin Magnussen in the last few races of 2016, but even that is a bit of a stretch. The only sure reason that Palmer was retained is because Magnussen wanted to have a longer contract, and thus left for Haas.
This whole Palmer situation has always felt like a compromise for the team, one that they are crazy to keep going with. Do they need his money? A works manufacturer team? Money is always good, but not if there are no results to accompany it. It feels like they’ve always known that it was never going to last.
Joe, you’re absolutely spot on about Sainz. I am delighted to see you mention this. Red Bull seem to rate him very highly, but as you say, there’s no spot for him at the senior team. There are lots of rumours about Ferrari being interested in either Ricciardo or Verstappen for 2018. Do you see either of them moving to leave a spot for Sainz? Is there any indication from Sainz’s camp that he is leaning towards Renault?
Why would either Ricciardo or Verstappen want to go to Ferrari just to be the number two driver to Vettel? I can’t imagine that Vettel would be too happy about it either…
There’s no way either would be a number two.
Ricciardo demolished Vettel in their year together, so I imagine that carries weight with Vettel’s current employers. He has 5 GP wins now and seems to be one of the elite drivers in the field.
Ferrari have had equal drivers before, Raikkonen/Massa for example.
The only way that Ric or Ver could join Ferrari if Red Bull did not have a “winning” car. Now that Red Bull has won a race there is unlikely to be that change unless a lot of money begins to fly around.
Wouldn’t be the first time Ferrari spent money to get a driver they rate highly. Didn’t they pay Kimi a lot of money to make space for Fernando Alonso back in 2010?
Traditionally, the notion ‘not possible’ has not been part of the F1 lexicon, therefore foolish romantics like myself would not be surprised to see Kubica in Spa. Of course, a Sainz move would make more sense, albeit I do wonder about the current state of relations between Viry and MK, Christmas cards?
Joe has anyone ever worked out why some drivers often have disproportionately shocking luck? Palmer has had the worst run imaginable, can’t help when he’s clearly been having a hard year.
F1 logic says that if a driver is unlucky he should be fired
Another thing that came up the book Total Competion, Ross said team bosses do take in account how lucky a driver when looking at who to sign.
That’s why Hulkenberg was Renault’s last choice, I guess.
Joe, “if you want to win, take a Finn”. Why not to give a call to Heikki Kovalainen. He knows Enstone people from 2006-2007.
How long ago was 2006?
Don’t forget Kovalainen jumped into the Renault (when it was called a Lotus) for the last two races of 2013, without any testing, and didn’t do too well (sadly). So while he has fairly recent experience of the team, the last of testing available means he’d probably not want to waste his time getting into the car.
/He knows Enstone people from 2006-2007./
He might also know them from 2013, when he replaced Kimi for the last races of the season. He might want not to remember that.
He raced for them in 2013. He was no good.
Take Kimi instead then.
It really is all down to the fees for any circuit. Silverstone need the race moved back to August not forward to June. As one of your commenters said the other day, In the UK parents are now aggressively pursued and fined by local councils (and probably get a criminal record too, as all civil infringements seem to have disappeared) now if they take children out of school for a day any reason, so there is a self imposed block by Liberty to introducing kids to F1. Half the experience used to be the camping on a Friday evening, this becomes significantly more important as the “F1festival week” is developed and families could have been there several days.
I suppose one cannot expect Americans to know about our laws straight off but it will be a problem later if they really do want to expand the audience age downwards.
It will be interesting it if all comes off, in a few years, to see how much more turnover is generated during the week, who gets to keep it and who pays tax on it.
Parts of the ‘UK’ have a school year that starts in August, so your points about Americans and “our laws” (sic) don’t really make any sense…
Except you can’t have a mid-August race because of the mandatory three-week shutdown.
You can’t move it to the end of July as that will bump Hungary up next to Austria.
You could perhaps do a Silvertone-Spa-Monza back-to-back-to-back at the end of August, but then that pushes Singapore further into the rainy season… perhaps no bad thing.
Not even sure you know the UK laws, let alone Americans. My daughter/s best friend at school (they’re 7) has today gone to Ibiza for 10 days. There will be no fines. Just as there were none when we took our own daughter out of school before October half term last year for a holiday.
To get past Williams, Renault would have to overtake STR in the points. Why would they help by letting Sainz go?
Joe, I understand your reasoning for Chili Sainz. However, a mid-season switch would be very difficult for Carlos, add to that the pressure to perform immediately. On top of that Toro Rosso would require a hefty compensation as it has depended on Sainz for the majority of the points with Daniil a limited contributor thus far. Why wouldn’t they sell Kvyat to Renault, I would think he is an improvement over Palmer who clearly is the worst driver in F1 together with Ericsson.
re Palmer, this might be a silly question, but could the number of DNF’s and general issues be symptomatic of someone who just doesn’t have quite the right skill set as the other drivers? That is, is he driving the car too hard/incorrectly when he shouldn’t be and stressing the machine to breaking point, or something of that nature? The answer could well be just very much bad luck, but given these things aren’t your run around town Toyota Prius i wondered if it was in part down to him not being able to man-handle the car in the correct fashion and he be out of his depth.
“Chucking out Palmer makes no sense unless there is a clear improvement, so there is little logic to have a Sergey Sirotkin, for example. There’s no time to teach new boys how to do things. The team says Robert Kubica is not a possibility and it is hard to get excited about any of the other options with suitable F1 experience.”
Why not look at drivers with a track record – Kobayashi, Di Resta and Vergne for instance. While I grant you that Di Resta and Vergne may not be ‘exciting’, the same criticism was labelled at Loterrer yet he came in and did a solid job for Caterham not so long ago.
Would it not also be possible for Renault to look to poach Wehrlein from Sauber? Given the state the Swiss team are in, one would imagine the driver would be keen on the move and Mercedes would prefer to see him in more competitive machinery too.
Then there’s Rio Haryanto and Felipe Nasr who did not disgrace themselves in recent times and would spark interest from their native country folk. I’d have added Rossi and Maldonado however one appears to have re-focused on Indycar while the latter would perhaps yield greater speed from the car however the end result of not seeing the chequered flag would remain the status quo for different reasons entirely..
Good point about Vergne, especially when you think about how close he was to Ricciardo back in their STR days.
Nasr not too bad a call either.
Problem with both is: they’d have to get used to the new cars.
You missed out Moss and Brooks, they’re still about 😉
What about Perez or Ocon?
Why would they leave?
With what you say about Werhlein being on shaky ground at Sauber, maybe Renault could try him.
Doesn’t sound like Longbow would put up much of a fight.
He’s a Mercedes driver
As is Ocon, yet Renault saw fit to have him test their car last year
Ocon was a Rnesult driver at that point
Hi Joe, that begs the question – what conviced Renault to let Ocon go?
Good question
I was under the impression that Ocon was a Mercedes driver who was on temporary loan to Renault for FP1 duties etc. at Renault, and then placed at Manor and subsequently Force India by Mercedes.
It was a very complicated story and even Esteban struggled to explain it to me!
That was my understanding too. Why would a similar arrangement as Ocon’s (complicated as it may be), not be possible for Wehrlein? Given the situation at Mercedes where they could retain Bottas for the short to medium term and have Ocon waiting in the wings too, might the situation not be perceived as similar to Sainz’s – a driver with undoubted talent but the team is contracted to has no where to take him.
Because they have different characters
I need to attend one of your evenings to dig into this further!
Would Wehrlein be bundled in with an engine supply deal to McLaren for 2018 potentially? May be hard to find a Mercedes seat elsewhere for him to go to.
Joe how about Brands Hatch as a venue, is a race possible there or is it way too small a facility ?
No
Just glad I got see a GP at Brands. I saw my first GP and Queen in concert at Wembley on the same weekend. I also paddled round Donnington as well so have seen GP’s at three different UK venues.
🙂
F1 and Brands Hatch and Queen at Wembley?
You have won at life my friend
Oh for the good old days when Brands *was* an F1 venue.
IIRC the last GP was in 1986 and Nigel Mansell’s fastest lap still stands as the absolute record for the GP circuit.
Three points for you Joe.
1. Joe Silverstone will probably get a last minute deal at the death . An F1 race will never happen in London as too many London residents will object the idea because of noise . It will also cause traffic bedlam for the in whole of London.
2.
On Palmer it is a shame if we don’t see him after the British GP in F1 this year but you could also argue that Renault aren’t really losing anything significant by dumping him mid season should they choose to do so but as you point out Joe any replacement may do no better and not benefit the team. I wouldn’t like to be the boss on that one. It’s a double edged sword with Palmer I suppose.
3.
Also Joe rumours have been sparked of a … and wait for it…Danish GP around the Copenhagen streets from 2020. Any truth in that Joe?
1) You need to read GP+ about the F1 plans in London. 2) They are more than rumours. There are proper plans and political support for a street race in Copenhagen. Will it happen? Ah, that’s another story.
What does GP plus say about London and F1 ? You’ll have to elaborate Joe as I cannot afford it as i’m not employed at present.
As to Copenhagen allow me to suggest a slightly sobering view from Denmark, at least as presented in Danish press.
There are definite plans. One rather important thing missing from the plans is getting the money (which IS rather an important point). So far a retired leading banker has stated that he will dedicate the next six months to getting private investors onboard. Whether he actually gets that is up in the air.
True there is political support. Only, this is support in words alone. Sure, the prime minister has said that a Copenhagen GP would be a great thing, but noone has pledged to pick up the tab or invest any serious public monies. The current Danish Prime Minister, Mr. Løkke Rasmussen, is heading a very shaky coalition and facing constant embers of rebellion in his own party, and widely lambasted for politics of austerity. Having him pledge public funds into a GP would be as close to political suicide as you would get.
Ditto goes for the Lord Mayor of Copenhagen, who is facing a hard-fought local election in the autumn, where the leftist party Enhedslisten is likely to become the determining factor in local Copenhagen politics for the next four years. They will support a GP with public funds AFTER pigs flying has become a regular feature of aviation.
And sure, the Danish Royal familiy has expressed that they support the idea – but since they carry no political clout, nor have any money (nor would be allowed to invest in something like this, if they had) that is pure window dressing.
As for public funding the scars of the financial debacle (scandal might be an appropriate word) that followed Copenhagen hosting the Eurovision Song Contest still are wide open. No one want to be at the sharp end of a repeat of that one.
Trafic infrastructure in Copenhagen is congested. If you look at a map of Copenhagen or, better, go there (beautiful place in the summer), the works needed to establish a F1 circuit in Central Copenhagen will essentially grind the city to a halt for long periods of time – months initially and weeks in case of repeat races. The city center is narrow, built-up and bordered in by water.
It will be pitchforks and torches time before the first F1 car rolls out.
Don’t get me wrong – I would love to see a GP in my native Denmark. But, realistically, a joint Scandinavian Grand Prix held at an existing race track somewhere, is a much more realistic prospect.
/Lord Mayor of Copenhagen, who is facing a hard-fought local election in the autumn, where the leftist party Enhedslisten is likely to become the determining factor in local Copenhagen politics for the next four years./
I also wonder about the attitude of local people – if they would really appreciate roaring cars in their city. I’d imagine a Formula E race rather than F1, but perhaps it’s my belief only.
Oh so boring Bo. It is good, there are still people around, who believe in flying pigs.
And would like to greet them…
Think positive, and fill you glass up. It is rather empty…
Sorry to come across as boring (well, my teenage kids call me at times, so maybe I am ,…).
I like to dream of a F1 GP in Denmark, and I do not rule out that it may come to pass. But what I did above was to look at some of the realities that has to be overcome.
There are practical issues, but those can be overcome with money.
The promoters are hoping to raise the majority of the estimated 300 million Danish Kroner budget from private sponsors.
Let us assume for a moment that they can do so (I do not rule this out).
The budget sounds like a lot, until you pick it apart. It is the equivilant of about 36 million pounds UK or 45 million dollars US.
Hosting fees run to more than a third of that, unless Copenhagen will get a huge discount (and why would they?)
Construction costs alone at Baku were reported by the chairman of Baku City Circuit around 38 million USD (and labour costs in Azerbaijan are nothing compared to Danish labour costs)
The budget is in red, even before any actual operating costs are in factored in.
This means that either further private funding will have to be found, or, as the promotors have suggested in Danish press, public funds must be made available to make up the rest.
Peter Nygaard (whom I respect very much for his F1 insights in the Danish press – Peter, if you read this, it is very much appreciated) stated that the bid has government support. True, but this, at the present, sounds better than it is..
If you read the Danish press, you will find statements of political support. However, all quoted are VERY careful to make it clear that they are not pleding any money. See quotes from minister of Business and Growth, Brian Mikkelsen, and Lord Mayor of Copenhagen, Frank Jensen, to that effect. They would love to have the cake AND eat it AND not have to pay.
A Copenhagen GP would fall under the juristiction of the municipality of Copenhagen and the Greater Copenhagen Regional Council. Given the expected political make-up of these bodies, and their recent history of getting badly burned in the parallel case of the Eurovision financial debacle, I don’t envision them footing any bill of uncertain size.
I believe that the promoters will need to raise a lot more money in private funds, rather than their current plan of a fixed private part and a flexible public funding to pick up the remainder, because that won’t fly politically. So far, they appear to be banking on free political goodwill turning into money. Helge Sander (the main promoter) tried the same thing three years ago with plans for a Danish GP in Herning, and got slapped down hard.
I, too, dream of pigs flying, and would like to greet them, just like you Søren. I really do. But, having been a licenced flight instructor for 15+ years, I have yet to encounter one.
So, yes, I am probably boring. So be it.
I would love to see a Grand Prix run at Silvertown (or very close by) instead of Silverstone. The Silver Lining to the black cloud hanging over the UK at the moment?
Unlike Singapore, there won’t be any subsidies coming from the government to run a street race in London. The idea is already dead in the water.
As for Silverstone, I don’t believe there’s ever been a business brain involved in running the place. The list of errors is endless, building pits that disappear below ground is just one example.
Not if you look at it from a bigger picture and see ways in which it could be funded privately. This is entirely possible.
Since it will be behind a paywall soon there won’t be many seeing it anyway. As for Palmer looks like the usual short term view that teams have these days. One could say that Verstappen has suddenly become crap when viewed against his dnf record this year. And that would be daft too. Renault just need to provide 2 cars that work and then give Palmer the chance to show what he can do or not. Vandoorne anyone? Exactly. Is he rubbish or is he looking bad because of Honda?d
+1
” .. evidence that F1 is not as easy as some financial types might think ”
To borrow the words of our current Chaos/Idiot in Chief .. ” Who knew ?”
With the answer here being the same …. Every(freaking)body on the planet with a modicum of knowledge and the slightest amount of common sense . Thats who !
I’ve thought this for a while, are you Christian Sylt?
If he is he will be banned forthwith
I doubt it – for all his many sins, CS is more literate than that. (And if it’s some kind of character then it’s not a very good one.)
My guess is a bit of panic from the Yankee F1 gang that came in with a sort of xenophobic bang hurling insults at the Baku and Malaysia’s out there in some sort of trump new world order style.
Furious backpeddling aside now merry old England is playing up and they will cut some sort of top secret deal with the old duffers at silverstone.
See no need of the government to be conned into a handout for such a wealthy activity. The PM is in enough bother as it is.
As regards a replacement for Palmer, I half-expect red Bull to hold on to Sainz just to stop other teams employing him.
Here’s a random thought: Jean-Eric Vergne.
1. He has experience in F1 and matched Ricciardo (who wasn’t that much less experienced than Vergne)
2. Has been racing in Formula-E (and doing fairly well) since leaving F1, so he’s still competitive
3. Unlike Hülkenberg and Palmer but like Renault, he’s French.
Hi Joe, maybe Jolyon Palmer has been terribly unlucky. However, he’s in his 2nd year in a seat (he didn’t exactly light any hearts on fire during year 1) so he’s had his shot in a very very competitive field. It’d be great to see Sainz make the step up. I think he has grown very frustrated at Torro Rosso and could use a change.
The question is, is the Renault a step up from the Torro Rosso for the remainder of 2017? If not, might Sainz be better served to keep cracking out the results and beating his teammate for the remainder of the season with a car that won’t break down and worry about 2018 once the season is taken care of?
The alternative could be that he finds himself up against an established Hulkenberg with a car that won’t make it to the chequered flag – how will that reflect on his reputation and standing across the paddock?
We should not forget F1 has a fickle memory – it was not so long ago Kobayashi was seen as Perez’s near enough equal at Sauber however compare their respective trajectories since their time as team mates. The same was the case with Heidfeld who was dealt harshly by Lotus despite numerous car troubles and leading his teammate in the championship when shown the door.
Don´t underestimate the possibility of a Danish Grand Prix in Copenhagen – this is a serious project with government backing.
I agree
Sainz is far more interested in a post-Kimi Ferrari seat. Why on earth would he sign for Renault before that gets decided?
Because the opportunity arises
Situations such as Fisichella swapping his Force India for a Ferrari and Kovalainen’s stand in appearance for Lotus suggests there is precedent that demonstrates jumping at any opportunity as opposed to the right opportunity frequently leads to disappointing results.
Part of me thinks that Jolyon looks so far from scoring points that they may as well gamble on Gasly. However, there are probably still people at the team who remember the Jarno Trulli/Jacques Villeneuve debacle and would be reluctant to try it again unless improvement was a sure thing.
I do feel for Palmer, though. A bit. He’s always been a driver who took an unusually long time to adjust to each new series he’s raced in. His father’s money has bought him time and with that time, up ’til now, he’s been able to mature into a very capable driver. He was showing signs of that in the latter races of 2016, but the new cars seem to have thrown him a googly. Unless something clicks for him right away, he’s toast. It’s just a question of whether he’s toast now or toast at the end of the season.
Agreed wrt Palmer requiring time to adjust. His junior formulae results suggests that if he is afforded time, he will improve however F1 is an environment not known for its patience (unless you’re talking about the McLaren Honda situation).
How about Buemi? He’s already part of the Renault stable in Formula E and reestablished himself very well over there.
He has Formula E and WEC contracts and is running for the championship in both
Palmer should never have been in F1. He won GP2 when the field was weaker than the previous year and had never beaten some of that year’s stars – some of whom SHOULD have been in F1 but didn’t have the money/name/influence
Joe
One important feature of Silverstone is that it is the nearest place where the majority of the people who design and build the cars and engines can see them in action once a year. This meant nothing to the tatty ‘aristocracy’ of the sport but surely gives added value
As it would be so cheap to bus all them hard working F1 workers in from the local factories it would be a no brainer for the government to hurl £10000000000 at it I guess.
Did Todt really invite Vettel to Paris for a discussion today? Should Vettel walk away from his actions with no penalty, I will know there’s something very fishy about F1 – still.
Yep
What about Felipe Nasr to Renault?
He is 100% fit and ready, as he says.
A grand prix in London would just be another example of F1 catering for those with plenty of money. Not many average folk can afford to stay in London for a few days over a grand prix weekend.
And do we really want more street circuits with their boring 90 degree corners?
In this world of quieter F1 cars, I too believe the future is for City/ Waterfront races. Baku was certainly a great experience!
Formula E has helped showing the way – although they are completely different animals to the wild turbo beasts in F1. What a fantastic thought with a race in the dock area of London. Just imagine that most spectators could walk or take their pushbike to the race track.
Same goes for the serious plan about F1 in old town Copenhagen. With Mr. Seier as Chief Whip, it is sure to happen…
About Renault/Sainz: Agree 100%. Seems like Jr. is unhappy now that Kyat is showing again his former self. But I question if Renault are able to efficiently service more than 1 car properly….
I feel really sad for Jolly Palmer, that he seems to be made the scapegoat for the problems, which, I guess, are related to the gap left in management after the efficient and respected Fred Vasseur packed up before the season.
(Kevin Magnussen surely did make the right choice, when he opted for Haas…)
Mumbles in Paris and all is forgiven. (I’d like to more about the telemetry tho…)
BBC reporting no further penalty besides saying sorry and agreeing to “devote personal time over the next 12 months to educational activities across a variety of FIA championships and events”
Yes, it’s a terrible ruling
Three points….
Silverstone have little choice than to pull the plug for now at least. Doubtless they will hope to be able to negotiate better terms for a future deal. I assume that the hot air London F1 proposal will be thrown at them but if they are sensible they should call Liberty’s bluff as the alternative is probably too big a financial risk to take. Bernie has pushed them to the brink of bankrupcy and they have to change the game to survive. No more Mr Nice Guy!
The conjouring trick of promoting an F1 race with the goal of stuffing the coffers of a US Hedge fund is becoming increasingly hard to pull off. Sensible democratic governments will not wish to be seen to support such activity financially. London has a successful marathon every year which attracts a lot of interest but this is completely free to spectators and though I don’t like the term it is ‘non-elitist’. There may well be opposition to an event that expects locals to cough up eye watering sums to watch a race on their own doorsteps as well as the inconvenience they will have to put up with. Even if the government were to give their blessing without any financial support they could face opposition from other parties. London at present is excercised by more pressing political matters than holding motor races and in any case London is not exactly a car friendly city these days. I don’t share the optimism that this idea of a London F1 GP is a viable proposition.
As for Palmer I have some sympathy and I suspect that Machivellian politics may play a part in the running of this team. In short I am not convinced that he currently has their full support. After all, they have this year given him several cars that were not fit for purpose. However it seems clear that his time at Renault is limited and I do not see that his future options in F1 are much better such is the cut throat nature of the business.
With Palmer the problem is the modern lack of attention span in business. As Mario Andretti famously said a driver just doesn’t suddenly get slow or become crap. If Renault could supply more than one reliable car then Palmer mihht have a chance as to finish first , first one has to finish!
With Silverstone and London the problem is continuous. I’m not taken in at all by Liberty being some sort of “F1 Rescuers”. They are like CVC just money makers. Suits. Accounysnts. Sure theyve made some sweet talk and are supposed to be sorting F1 for the future. And they maybe less blinkered than CVC were. However ultimately their brief is to make $ and like Bernie, if the $ isn’t there then they will set their tent up elsewhere. So I don’t believe that they will be any more Fan or History Friendly than CVC.
If Liberty get some decent US location and have a choice between that and 60 years of Britain….no need to guess which they will chose! Don’t forget that they come from the Home and Sole location of the “World” Series of Baseball.
As for London. I had a £1 on Ricciardo to win in Baku. I wouldn’t waste my £1 on the possibility of a London F1 race.
There is a third option for Silverstone. They could break new ground and bring in someone who got a clue!
Private investment on this scale is usually guaranteed by the government. So what’s the real difference. If its a success the beneficiaries are not average people and if its not the bill is picked up by Mr and Mrs Average Taxpayer. Then add in the incentives given by government because its not their money they giving away and the whole thing is the con it is. To me this is little different to the con of out sourcing by government. It still costs the same, its just smoke and mirrors financing.
These “developments” are not for family homes but are just rabbit hutches that are currently drug dens, brothels and huge occupancy hell holes. I recently did some consultancy work around this area and the company I was working for reckoned in 15 years time the area will be a ghetto, once the foreigners who own these “bought off plan” properties have paid for themselves 3 times over and now require capital investment because they jerry built. As for industry, how are the workers going to live when a converted garage costs nearly £1,000 a month in rent in nearby Plaistow? Until housing is addressed any low paid driven workforce development in the south east is not sustainable.
Liberty Media should be working to make proper races at proper circuits work and not some random part of London which has nothing going for it visually, is a transport blackspot (both road and public) and which is perfect for proper housing. A race in London needs proper backdrops like Big Ben.
At the moment they’d be better sniffing around Belfast if they wanted taxpayers support. They have possession of the magic money tree.
I recall that Singapore costs the organisers US$100m a year in total. Whether that’s covered by the tourism increase or not, who knows. My Singapore friends are extremely irritated by the disruption the GP brings and attendence is well down nowadays. Eventually the politics of this will end the race there.
Most street races aren’t very successful over a long term from a financlal aspect – Valencia is a classic example. And thus, whilst it might be exciting to see F1 cars trundle down Bank Street and around the fountain at Cabot Square, that’ll be a transient experience. I don’t see this becoming a reality.
Silverstone are going to exercise the break clause and Liberty will look at ways of helping the event break even, perhaps by loosening the shackles on advertising and income thereof. Of course this sents a precedent for other circuits once their contracts come up for renewal/break and Liberty must take that into account.
I can see a situation where Silverstone sign a series of one-year deals whilst Liberty look at credible alternatives for either venues or pricing structures that work.
Joe, does Jonathan Palmer have any influence over Renault F1 (even from a commercial standpoint) that he could be using to keep Jolyon in the seat? Nice kid but I can’t understand how he got another season/is still in his seat. Has not shown across any race that he can reach the top and the fact that Stroll has now turned it around and done it over two races despite his patchy start doesn’t bode well from him.
Di Grassi, D’Ambrosio and Vergne all are experienced racers with various links to the Renault F1 corporate structure and all have some F1 experience. Certainly with the latter two, both who fit into the Renault French type of drive (I know Jerome is actually from Belgium but still). Is there a chance of any getting in over Palmer? Certainly think they should and start grooming Prost Jnr and Gasly for future drives….
Oh dear Elliot. Had you watched GP racing when I was a kid then Jochen Rindt would never have been World Champion. Neither would those like Gilles Villeneuve got a chance and Mansell certainly would not have!
The modern style of you either get a win in 20 races or you are dumped is totally pathetic and one of the reasons that im not addicted to F1 anymore.
If you want to really become a passionate spectator then buy and read Brian Redman, Daring Drivers , Deadly Tracks. Once youve read that book you won’t make the same comments ever again.
I’m not entirely sure the relevance of your comments. You can enjoy living in the past while I talk about current motorsport 👍
The relevance was in relation to your support of short termism in motor racing. Apart from Nicolas Prost being in modern terms a Grandad and therefore could not be remotely considered for an F1 drive, your other comments indicate that you haven’t an attention span that would allow for such as Mansell for example, to have nearly three and a half years in an F1 car before winning a GP!
This is why folk like Vergne never get a fair shot now. In the past great drivers emerged from longish periods of seat time. Now they get plugged in and unplugged after 8-10 races unless they hit targets that are unrealistic particularly so since only 6 competitive seats exist. On the other hand you get the equally stupid rejoicing when some lowly team scores a 10th place!
In the case of Palmer the guy seems a competent driver. If Renault could produce 2 equal cars then one could have a better idea of his talents. On the face of it there’s no actual point replacing him this year unless someone is out there with some cash for Renault!
Nicholas Prost is 35 years old. Groom him for what? Why not just bring back Jean Aleso by that daft reasoning.
Palmer is not top draw like Hamilton, Vettell and Alonso, but he is still quick. Like last season he needs the rub of the green and then he will show his worth. He out raced Kevin Magnussen in the second half of last year to secure the seat.
Granted, that one was the nostalgic in me coming out!