More on the Team Lotus Caterham deal

The decision of the High Court in London on the question of the use of the name Team Lotus in Formula 1 is coming shortly, but Tony Fernandes and his business partner Kamarudin Meranun are not really bothered about the result. They seem to be fairly confident that they will be given the right to use the Team Lotus brand, not just in Formula 1, but also in all aspects of business. If this is the decision taken then the only real point of interest in the affair will be what the judge decides about Group Lotus’s use of Team Lotus history as a marketing tool for its products in the course of the last 18 months and whether or not he feels that Group Lotus should be allowed to use a black and gold livery in F1. Black and gold is a livery long associated with Team Lotus and he may deem this to be some form of passing off. If that happens then Renault will need to change its appearance.

There is probably nothing much that can be done about Group Lotus wanting to sponsor an F1 team other Team Lotus, illogical though that may be. What is clear, even at this point, is that the Renaults should not be called Lotuses. Group Lotus obviously wants people to confuse Renaults with Lotuses, but one does not call a Ferrari a Marlboro or a McLaren a Vodafone. Lotus is the sponsor, not the car.

Anyway, Fernandes and Kamarudin are going to start building road cars. This is no real surprise. They have introduced the emerging Asian middle class to such things as credit cards, mobile phones, cheap flights, cheap hotels and even hire cars. Their next move, albeit with a different brand name, is to create low-cost sport cars for those who can afford them. It is a good moment to be doing it and if the price is right they will be successful. The original plan was to do that with the Lotus brand. This has been largely wasted in the last 15 years, under Proton ownership. The aim of buying Lotus was to give the Malaysian automobile industry some more technology, but that did not help a great deal. Group Lotus’s parent company Proton still builds cars that are not really competitive in the open markets. If there were not restrictions in Malaysia the place would be awash with better products from Nissan and Toyota at the same price (or less) than Proton. Reviving Lotus is a strange idea, particularly as it means moving the company up through the luxury brands to a level at which it will be almost impossible to compete, even with an audience in Asia that does not really know that a Lotus and a Ferrari are not the same thing.

Fernandes’s vision for Lotus was different and indeed seemed to be much more inline with the original Chapman concept of building light sporting cars at a price that people can afford. As Group Lotus has gone off on its wild goose chase to become Ferrari, Fernandes and Kamarudin have been left wondering what to do. Their response is an intelligent and logical one. They will build up another brand and wait to see whether Lotus comes on the market. They still own Team Lotus and Caterham Cars is the perfect solution because Caterham grew out of Lotus when the original Lotus decided to leave the Lotus 7 behind and build fancier models. The Lotus 7 became the Caterham Super 7. Caterham’s Graham Nearn and his engineers evolved the capabilities of the car, increasing the engine size and tweaking the chassis.The cars have continued to sell well ever since and have become a major part of club racing in many countries since the launch of the first Caterham one make series in 1986. There are currently over 700 registered owner drivers racing in 17 such championships in nine countries, including the UK, France, Germany, the United States, South Africa, Japan and in the Gulf region. The road cars are exported all over the world with important markets being France, Japan, Germany and the United States. There are dealerships in other far-flung places but there is plenty of potential to expand, particularly in Asia.

In 1987, in need of more production capacity, Caterham moved to a much larger facility in Dartford, Kent, 25 miles from the town of Caterham and success was such that in 1993 the firm won a Queen’s Award for Exports.

In the mid 1990s Caterham decided to look at building a more styled version of the Caterham Super 7. This was called a Caterham 21 and was unveiled at the British Motor Show in 1994. It was billed as a car that offered “Caterham motoring in a more practical format”. Only around 50 of the cars were sold despite plans for a production run of 200. Although not a success at the time, the Caterham 21 is now a sought-after collector’s car.

Nearn retired in 1997 and in 2005 the business was sold to a management buy-in, led by former Ford Motor Company executive Ansar Ali, a former general manager of Lotus Cars.

Fernandes and Kamarudin will give details of their plans for the company tomorrow at Duxford aerodrome. It is anticipated that the Formula 1 team will become known as Caterham Team Lotus. This programme will thus support both the Team Lotus and the Caterham brands. And there is little doubt that if Group Lotus’s current expansion plans flop Fernandes and Kamarudin will be there to pick up the pieces and turn the company around, just as they did with AirAsia 10 years ago.

66 thoughts on “More on the Team Lotus Caterham deal

  1. Hi Joe,

    Wouldn’t a ‘Caterham Team Lotus’ team be as confusing as ‘Lotus Renault GP’? I mean: a potential Caterham buyer will see a Lotus-Renault on the grid, with Caterham sponsorship, not a Caterham-Renault, or even a Lotus-Caterham.

    Might Fernandes be cutting his losses regarding the Lotus-Lotus confusion, whether he wins the court case or not, whilst renaming his own team ‘Team Caterham’… and perhaps even sell the Team Lotus moniker to Lotus Group to rename ‘Renault GP’?

  2. Joe, one of the things that has puzzeled me was David Hunt’s statement a few months ago which was really critical of Tony just prior to the court case.

    Do you think that David’s issue was to do with Tony’s plans with Caterham? Specifically he’d sold ‘Team Lotus’ as purely an F1 team and here was Tony with plans to merge it with another brand and car company (regardless of the relation between the brands).

    Personally I think it’s great news, especially as someone born in Dartford. Up until recently I thought Lotus cars had done a fine job filing a niche market of pure, lightweight and relatively cheap sports cars you could take to the track (Elise/Exige).

    It just seems bonkers to suddenly up your target to Ferrari in the middle of a massive global recession when you had a half decent product anyway!

    1. MartynB,

      I think that david Hunt was trying to get something and was told where to go. Hence no sound at all since.

  3. I’m not convinced that “Caterham Team Lotus” is the plan, to be honest – what would be the value in making Caterham effective title sponsor of the Team Lotus team?

    I’ve been thinking for a while that now Group Lotus are deserting the ‘simplify and add lightness’ concept Caterham are ideal inheritors however. Their cars are simple, light, well made and reliable. The “21” wasn’t a success because it was (relatively) large, not particularly well-styled, had a ride height more often seen on swamp buggies and wasn’t actually that practical – and then the Elise came along and showed how it should be done. But with no more Elise (soon) and cars getting ever heavier… it’s an open goal.

    Forza Norfolkii. 🙂

    1. Lewis,

      I try to help you, but if you won’t listen, what can I do? The answer is Caterham Team Lotus.

  4. Joe,
    An interesting development. I feel sure that Tony would have liked to use Lotus Cars as a vehicle for his automotive aspirations. This may be why there is now a rift between Group and Team.
    A lot of traditional Lotus buyers will no doubt look on this kindly. If he does it right, he may well finds that Caterhams customer base expands exponentially.
    Dany Bahar must feel very uncomfortable about this new development!
    I have worked for Lotus in Malaysia. Don’t blame Proton totally for the lack of imagination concerning Group Lotus. Lotus has plenty of ex pats earning very good money over there who use the term ‘Think outside the box’ as a corporate mantra, but either have no wish too do so, or are unable too.
    Probably both.

  5. Another master piece. Cheers Joe so much insight, Tony and his crew just seem like guys that are working with their feet on the ground. Caterham is a good brand and the kind that makes sense for a small F1 outfit to have as it offers enthusiasts a taste and involement in F1 at an affordable price compared with mclaren’s MP4 12c. If I could afford the Mclaren it would be the F1 brand of choice but like most a Caterham with F1 cridentials makes sense to me. Remembering that Caterhams are also sold as kit cars the F1 associations will only help drive sales.

  6. But if Tony & Co can’t sell their road cars as ‘Lotuses’, only as ‘Caterhams’, what’s the point in having a Formula One team called ‘Team Lotus’?

    By the criteria at the top of your post, we’ll still have to call Tony’s F1 cars ‘Lotuses’, not Caterhams.

    I doubt the average Malaysian will know, or give two hoots, whether the old Caterhams were once based on an old Lotus design.

    Wouldn’t Tony be better off ditching the Team Lotus name in F1 and renaming his team (and the cars that will race) Caterham?

    1. Ben G,

      Because they have plans for the “Team Lotus” brand and, I believe still want to buy Lotus itself.

  7. Oh dear Dany!!!
    Done up like a kipper.
    Hats off to TF and partners. Caterham Cars are about to flourish and poor Lotus…………………well, erm er. Just have to hope TF wants it when the idiots have done with it.
    If it wasnt so sad for Lotus it would be hilarious.
    Just as a thought Joe, how long do you reckon Bahar will last at Proton?

    1. Andy H,

      I suspect that there are people taking bets on it somewhere, but I am not a gambler. The Malaysians need a fall guy if it all goes wrong… and my feeling is that there is a Bahar-sized jacket with a very big target on the back. However, it might be expensive to get rid of him as he is believed to have a very expensive contract which someone in Malaysia agreed to. I guess that there will be some bloodletting there as well, but probably they will be subtle about it….

  8. Joe, will Caterham be a sponsor of Team Lotus? In which case they’ll still be known as Team Lotus, as per Renault? I couldn’t see Renault agreeing to a name change if the team is still using a Lotus name.

    1. Phil C,

      I think the announcement will be that Team Lotus will be called Caterham Team Lotus. The Renault team is called Lotus Renault GP. Renault has no say in any of it beyond supply them both with engines, in exchange for cash.

  9. Well, this seems sensible. Niches like well financed nutters. Or is it they exist because of the same…

    . . .

    Bahar, “The same thing we do every night, Pinky—try to take over the world!”

    (“Pinky and The Brain”, a wonderful cartoon, where to my mind, if you are impoverished as to the experience, every grand plan is thwarted by the normal mouse’s common sense as much as his “stupidity”.)

    TF, “Bugger this, cars, fast, sell ’em. Plan. OK?”

    (If you have a long term plan, start delivering, is all i can think. That’s building a brand.)

    . . .

    Can’t help but encourage a potential Koenigsegg with a twist of F1 engineering for the common man.

    Sounds like a dream, and i’m projecting. No blimming way can my back tolerate a real sporting suspension anyhow. But the key point, see Para 1, is he can afford to sustain this kind of thing.

    – j

    hmm. p.s. i think . . .

    Caterham Team Lotus F1 etc. etc. is getting unwieldy.

    p.p.s. phew, made it without commenting on the case. Result!

  10. I’m confused – not for the first time. I thought it was not a simple business (nor inexpensive) to change an F1 team’s name. Will they really want to spend a lot of money to change the name to Caterham Team Lotus, or will Caterham merely be a sponsor (a la Lotus is to Renault)?

    Also it would seem incongruous to me if the judges decided that simply because, many years ago, a team raced for a few seasons with various black & gold liveries, it should invalidate any current team from running with a similar livery. We’d soon run out of possible paint designs for the cars.

    I feel quite positive about the idea of Caterham and Team Lotus working together though. As you say that is a bit of a throw back to the Chapman days. Very interesting.

    1. Terry Worth,

      You can add a sponsor name easily enough. The problem is changing the name of the chassis

  11. Quote: “one does not call a Ferrari a Marlboro or a McLaren a Vodafone. Lotus is the sponsor, not the car”

    I remember when I was at school and I always referred to Team Lotus’ F1 cars as Lotus 72s and my mates all called them John Player Specials…

  12. A great idea from TF, cant think of another small British car company with as good a reputation as Caterham, and comes with none of the big company baggage. the previous Lotus link is just the icing on the cake.

  13. also for MartynB,

    David Hunt’s comments just before court were to my mind stunningly arrogant nonsense meant to insult, not even decent sabre rattling. If it were a criminal court, you might imagine a defiant oik flipping a finger and something like “Gonna beat this rap, suckers”. (and you may guess the lesson that usually gets taught very next thing to such types) No, DH isn’t lowlife, but it was hardly dignified, sounded like nerves much as anything, so i think my analogy holds in comparative context.

    Like Joe said, silence.

    I’ll add: golden.

    Not diving into it, but presumably the listings are not also in camera. Anyone know where it’s at?

    Honestly, though, i’d be happy to forget about it all. Group will either replace Bahar, or not find the money spare to keep their sponsorship going, and there’ll be a natural conclusion. I’m guessing the litigants might be pleased to forget also . . can it all have been a misguided tax deductable attempt at publicity seeking and personal ego massaging . . a sideshow to the M’sian game (TF slapping wrists, DB wriggling) . . . does anyone much care any more, now there’s no fight night?

    Caterham deal sounds plain decent to me. Nice.

    OK, little thought on the case. I think it is in camera, not because of anything to do with the headline arguments, but because there are skeletons in contractual closets, and because there really could have been money worries. Now, which of these outfits is a big enough company to be sensitive to disclosures of being short a bob or a million?

    (and conversely, in case i have been delerious and hence subtle for a change, which one is the billionaire? :-))

  14. How about scenario that Team Lotus stays Team Lotus, but they will create new production line for Team Lotus brand in Caterham?

    Why TF & Din would “sell” title sponsor place for Caterham?

    Doesn´t make sense for me. They both are spending about 500.000€/ week for Team Lotus. So they will find out some well known major brand for title sponsor.

  15. IMO it’d be quite illogical if TL can use TL name in all aspects of business, but GL only in automobile industry outside F1. IMO TL should own Lotus in F1 and GL in other automobile industry. Outside automobile industry ‘Lotus’ should IMO belong to the first party who adopts it. And if Team Lotus is deemed to be a separate brand from Lotus of Group Lotus, how come TL can call their chassis as Lotus, as Lotus would be a trade mark of GL.

  16. Joe,

    I hope TF et al read your blog. My suggestion is that Caterham buy the rights to manufacture the TVR Griffith. It should never have gone out of production.

    Here’s hoping.

  17. My outside bet: the Caterham name will fall to the wayside, and the 7 will soon be known as the Team Lotus 7, with other models being the TL Super 7 and the TL Super 7 Caterham Edition… 😉

    Just a hunch.

    Why keep the Caterham name?

  18. Joe yet another first class piece of journalism.

    There are two things I’ve noticed about this news. Firstly that is overwhelming popular with most racing fans and secondly there seems to be an undercurrent of people getting hot under the collar regarding the inclusion of Caterham in the name.

    Personally I don’t think it makes any difference. Between 1992-1993 it was referred as Castrol Team Lotus, and 1987-1990 Camel Team Lotus. It makes next to no difference whichever name is prefixed to the front of the Team Lotus bit.

    I would appreciate knowing from anyone on here what happens to Classic (yet another prefix beginning with C) Team Lotus should the court case favour Tony Fernandes. Will the team have to redress its merchandising, name and activities?

    Finally I am so sick and tired of people saying this isn’t the “real” Team Lotus. The Bentley “Team” that won Le Mans in 2003 was not the “Real” Bentley of the 1920s yet people happily counted it as Bentley success despite the fact the car borrowed heavily Audi R8C and was financed entirely by Volkswagen.

    Ironically enough the Speed 8 was also assembled, not in the old Bentley factory in Cricklewood but the RTN Factory which Team Lotus now calls it home.

  19. What a disappointment! I genuinely thought TF was a real Lotus enthusiast not someone just trying to make a quick buck with cheaply bought heritage

    If TF has actually been wanting to acquire Group Lotus at a knockdown price from the outset is it any wonder that Group Lotus and Proton decided to revoke the licence over something trivial?

    If hes bought Caterham then they should rebrand and concentrate on that business and let Lotus get on with their business. He is just as opportunistic as D Bahar, so not worthy of any more pity or support than Group Lotus.

    Bizarrely though if the two sides concentrate on their own brands and teams then the only way they will be clashing is on the race track as it should be.

    lets hope we get Team Caterham with a small sportscar business and Lotus GP with a related supercar business based at hethel going forward, with market forces and on track performance chosing the winner or deciding they can co exist.

    If not I think I’ll support anyone overtaking a black or green Lotus. Disgraceful!

  20. A revival of the 21 would be good because I know it was a hell of a lot of extra work fitted in around the normal production problems of the mainstream model 7xx. This would possibly compete with the MG, now being manufactured again by SAIC at Longbridge. (a sad trickle compared to Longbridge of the past, so badly betrayed by the Phoenix four.)

    Well it’s too late for early onset Alzheimer’s for me, that would have been some years back, I wish I could remember the name of the guy who designed it, (the 21) he was the chief engineer at the time and was very hands on in all areas. Jez it was!!

    Since TL have used Duxford before, for straight line tests, can we expect a dramatic entrance? “Opening music from the Prisoner” dry ice cloud on track 50 m left, Enter Tony flat out in a 7. though cloud. Skids to a halt. (Tony is wearing a blazer with large “Village” badge saying “1”) Leaps out, strides over and pounds table. “Ladies and gentlemen of the press……”

  21. @Brian

    have you seen this?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melling_Wildcat

    joe – thanks once again for your usual class journalism, there is a good reason I check your blog almost every day without fail, and this article illustrates it brilliantly.

    Good luck to TF, he seems to have a pretty good gift for business; caterham are a great business, probably undervalued in the current market and their brand is very powerful; it makes perfect sense for him to take them and try to move into Asia. I still think his endgame must involve buying the Lotus brand also, and moving in with the two brands; one for road-based track cars (as caterham are more or less now) and one for track-inspired road cars (as lotus should be!). The two brands would complement each other very nicely, and would probably work very well together…so hopefully he will be able to make it happen!

  22. Cort,

    Jake is the link man, and i like him. Generalist’s job, and he’s amongst specialists, so that’s how i measure him.

    Could he be up his own enough, to give someone an argument, which is very strong in tmark law, that there is public confusion as to origin?

    I doubt it. But it doesn’t matter, because it was broadcast. I didn’t notice it. Not a point of professionalism i’d call the guy on personally.

    There’s a chap called Martin Schwimmer who blogs on the reality and much – a – do silliness of tmarks who pokes lawyeristic humor at this kind of thing. Don’t bother he’s American, the ideas are the same. In a full blown case, with truly big names, this might count rather a lot.

    I think the case, wherever it’s at, is behind or beyond such points. Behind, because there’s marks to be established. Beyond, because this is hardly new evidence.

    Joe, not disagreeing, just wish i had some insight into where they walk the timelines from, up the Strand.

    – j

  23. Christ, i hope you lot are all wrong and Bahar makes the Lotus plan work…lotus have lost money for years trying to sell elise/exige so that strategy was failing so they had to try something different…perhaps going upmarket is the answer.Look at Evo magazine June issue-Bahar talking sense to me..

  24. It seems the “Caterham Team Lotus” brand will be promoted heavily in the rebranded Caterham dealerships and Caterham’s own racing league than it would be promoted in F1. If F1 is to be used as a promotional platform, TF and co. will surely be one of the best to utilize it.

    Associating the Team Lotus to Caterham has little benefit to TL yet benefits Caterham a lot. This association is more Caterham-centric than TL-centric, as seen by a lot of people at the moment. In this scenario, TL is just a tool and not the focus.

    In short, TF is using the “Team Lotus” brand to promote the “Caterham” brand, not the other way round.

  25. Team Lotus has registered 2 new internet domains,

    sonangolcaterhamf1.com and sonangolcaterhamteamlotus.com.

  26. Re ‘Black and Gold’ – group Lotus can point to the road car liveries of the 70’s presumably, all of course approved by Colin Chapman.

    I am mystified as to why Group Lotus cannot make money out of the cars they make now. They are universally praised, their USP
    is brilliant handling relatively affordable sports cars, a market they largely own. It does look as though they would have been better off in TF’s hands …

    But I cannot see why TF will want to continue promoting another sports car companies name in the long run.

  27. onyx,

    it’s not unusual for a rival to trick their competitor into overstretching themselves, and pick up the pieces on the cheap.

    That’s just about happening now.

    Not predictable, however, because of Group / Proton ownership. Just it suddenly makes more sense of all the strategically not big deals. On the surface, Caterham looks a neat purchase. But no way is it big enough either in terms of TF’s ambition, or going to make a sufficient financial impact on his bottom line.

    -j

  28. Please let the new owners of Caterham, ahem, cater to guys with large feet! Even if I wanted a 7 I can’t safely drive one – there’s not room for three pedals and my big feet in the pedal box.

  29. for onyx again,

    three most useful words in English,

    “Consider the source”

    especially handy for quashing or sidestepping silly rumors.

    . . .

    Ricky,

    My own hope is TF hires some nutters for Caterham.

    It really only needs boatloads of money if they swing for radical or ego stroking projects, and that wouldn’t be Caterham.

    Just give the boys the tools they need (which can be surprisingly modest), a quiet house to work from, with enough garden to take decent walks to discuss in private, and someone to cook and tidy up. No offices, fancy rebrands, no eating lotus leaves (intended) in the cool penumbra cast by F1. Just a bunch of people told to go make cars. Oh, and give them *time*. By time, i mean also fast execution and iteration.

    Lockheed called their incredibly well funded secret projects “Skunkworks”, but they were pushing extraordinary science. For very obvious reasons i prefer the British, Bletchley (sans personal intrusiveness a la Turing) way. But the idea is the same.

    This is an infamous, mythical, but true story as to the amazing things which happened when IBM just took “above average” people and stuck them together:

    http://www.t3.org/tangledwebs/07/tw0706.html

    That’s not very detailed, it would take a lot to find really good histories. But i can give a clue. Look up IBM’s VM OS for the mainframe. That was virtualisation 40 years ago. To do virtualisation, you certainly have to know how to throw unusual test cases at your code. Similarly a very tight team.

    I hate plans, and i particularly hate business plans. They are never as good as a idea a handful can agree on, plus necessity. But hey, i’m not rich as a result. I like to figure i’ve not learned enough yet! Still, commenting as i am hypocritically inclined to discuss others’ business plans.

    But seriously, the big question, is: what kind of nutters?

    (that’s my, hardly unique, bugaboo)

    Not whether F1 branding rubs off.

    You know that’s not possible. Consider the source. Or, for one example, consider Joe’s magazine name. In your example, Caterham would be unable to use F1 in any way unless they became a manufacturer. That would defeat the entire mojo of the Caterham name, in my book.

    I’m not bashing your thoughts, Ricky, because obviously there’s connexions and mental associations to be made, and people will notice that. But think things through. I sincerely hope (with good evidence) that TF is not on some wheeze, spreading marketing fluff about his deals. As i noted above, to onyx, these are too small to impact his business, positively or negatively, unless he’s a wastrel, which patently he isn’t.

    I’m an avowed supporter of TF, but he is by no means – yet – for me, a giant. Gigantism, in business, may carry with it too many flaws and inherent sins, so meanwhile i like to pay attention to who i think is a breath of fresh air.

    – j

  30. Completely brilliant Saward work as usual. I live a stones throw from Hethel, still know quite a few at Group and I can tell you that while they’re not apparently worried, they are deeply uneasy about where this is all going. However Bahar will take a mighty lot of dislodging and he’s surrounded by a cocoon of his own people.

    I’ve met most of the senior management, Donato included, and spent time filming HRH The King of Malaysia along with the Proton CEO, they all want it to succeed and are genuine in that desire, for sure.

    I really do hope that Group get it right and sell thousands of cars, I may not like what they’re building but economically it will be great for Norfolk, the UK and so on.

    What I would hate to see, and fear, is lots of hype and not much sales action.

    Joe’s earlier piece on the loans Group have secured made scary reading, the Evora (pre Bahar in fairness) isn’t setting sales records (I’m told, correct me if I’m wrong) and the new models are still quite a way off.

    Someone, somewhere, sometime is going to want some of that $450 million repaid, and that’s what’s going to separate the men from the boys.

    Keep up all the great work Joe.

  31. Hmmm…

    “the following five domain names were registered by Net Names, the same company that hosts Team Lotus’ current domain: sonangolcaterham.com, sonangolcaterhamf1.com, sonangolcaterhamf1racing.com, sonangolcaterhamf1team.com and sonangolcaterhamteamlotus.com.”

    Which explains why Ricardo Texeira was given track time during the winter, and also shows that TL isn’t all that sure of winning this. But in the event of losing the battle, does this also say that all teams will allow TL to change the car’s name to Caterham, next year or in fact mid-season, without the outfit losing Bernie’s money?

  32. I can’t believe how anyone here can see this deal in any other way than a face saving escape plan by Fernandes and co! I mean what the f#$% is Caterham other than a bit part player in the Automotive world. That fact will never change. Look at their experiment with the 21. That was a beautiful design with great handling but was almost completely rejected by the Caterham market who obsess over 50g weight increase. Group Lotus knows this well……u can’t make money on optional extras where the big profits are when ur whole ethos is saving every last gramme in weight. Sadly, Caterham will always be known for the 7 and will remain a 500 per year, low profit company with zero expansion possibilities. NO ONE in Asia will buy them (outside the madcap Anglophiles in Japan who buy a steady number but Japan doesn’t really count as Asia anyway) Certainly not in China or India or SE Asia or the ME for that matter. Sports cars there are about flash, power and straightline speed, to be enjoyed on the new mega highways that are being completed on a daily basis. There are no quaint English country roads and the weather would melt you without aircon…..
    The Group Lotus business plan has much sense than the nonsense rambling peddled by Fernandes. Bahar has brought together ex Ferrari, ex AMG big guns to join in along with Kabfell chap who are putting their own money into it. These are guys who have been there and done that. These are guys who understand the market and who know what the Asians want in a car. Their plan for Ferrari performance at a 30% discount is totally sound in my obviously minority opinion. (170k pounds for a 458 versus 120k pounds for the Espirit with more power) People who say they are a direct competitor are obviously not the target market coz who the f#$% thinks that 120 is the same as 170? Audi wouldn’t sell any R8 V10s if that were the case. If they do deliver the promised product (not unreasonable judging by the CVs of those involved) 120k pounds for a 611bhp mid engine supercar with a famous badge will sell. I may be wrong but I don’t believe you can get a sports car with over 600bhp for under 200k pounds though the McLaren is close but that’s 170k before options.
    As for your shameless attack on David Hunts character……. There has never been a bad word I’ve read about Hunt before this. Hunt’s silence could be that a) Fernandes has corrected the situation or b) Fernandes has muzzled him. Doesn’t have to be that Hunt was necessarily a bad person?? You really don’t have to look very hard to find some, ahem, “different” opinions on the integrity and honesty of Fernandes.
    It’s such a great shame that you are so biased on the reporting on this topic. For me it detracts greatly on your usually more balanced insight on most things in F1.

  33. Onyx,

    The 5 model plan is absolute madness. I would have been ok with 1 or 2 new models but suddenly pouring in something like 750m dollars from state guaranteed loans is poor business.
    Proton have owned lotus for ages. Lotus have a fantastic chassis engineering division that proton gave singularly failed to use on it’s own cars.

    Tony Fernandes IMO has shown he actually has business savvy and can actually run a company successfully. And therefore he will get my support.

    The fact they’ve bought caterham just makes it even better.

    P.s Joe I’m pretty sure you were one of the first to break the caterham story (you’re always first or near!) good investigative journalism rather than reporting 🙂

  34. People need to stop obsessing over the websites. They’ve no doubt been bought up by hopeful cybersquatters as soon as the news broke with hopes of making a few quid.

  35. Sawan,

    you have just totally sold me a “California”.

    Not that that would be my first, but it sounds sensible.

    You just hit on the absolute truism – if i read you right – if you want to buy a nice, really nice, car, what the heck is 20 grand? You drop that, walking out of the showroom. Come on, for heaven’s sake. You’re not kidding me, you’re being kidded.

    I’m not bragging, i’m a terrible driver, not a idiot sunday track monster, not rich, i like to cruise, this is a reason why i don’t have a nice home in the counties, and i’ll let you ridicule me. But the way to sell cars is not to slag off another lot, else you get it in your face. I don’t see your point. Get a car, and drive it. Scratch the itch. I need to!

    Miura, by the way, is my car, when i make it. That’s a different kind of different world.

    Oh, David Hunt, by the way, like anyone involved, is silenced by court and i’d hazard he benefits from that.

    – j

  36. Thx for the compliment!

    Most specialist Automotive publications that have interviewed Bahar have positive views on his plans. And he has repeated in those interviews that he showed 5 concepts for maximum impact but doesnt expect to build them all and that only the Espirit is confirmed.

    i for one doubt Fernandes’s staying power. He is rich but he isn’t that rich. Just a fraction of Vijay Mallya’s wealth thats for sure. Definetly not rich enough to continue to burn money in F1 indefinetly without a major sponsor thats not one of his own companies. He has already said that a loss of the 2010 prize money for 10th place (17m pounds) would bankrupt the team so things are on a wire there. Plus they were by far the worst paymasters of the 11 teams polled last year with average payment time of 6 months!

    My bet is that he will sell out of the team or be forced to put Texeira in Trulli’s seat to get the Angolan millions which is the same thing anyway as even Karthikeyan in a HRT would be too quick for him to handle. Time will tell….

    1. Sawan,

      You are obviously an expert in all of this so I will not challenge your views. Time will indeed tell. Come back in a year and we will see who is still around. You show very little understanding of Tony Fernandes. Perhaps if you had met him you would understand that he is a very impressive individual, who knocks spots off the Mallyas and Bahars. A word of warning about your bet. Don’t put your house on it.

  37. Mr. Saward

    While i agree (for the most part) your comments regarding the Caterham purchase by TF. Your comments towards anyone who disagrees with your analysis shows some serious lack of class and respect.
    While it can be argued that this is your blog and your entitled to do as you please with it common sense would hope to dictate that you would think about how you respond when challenged.. especially considering you are also promoting a product that you also write for.

    You want respect as a journalist? Show some respect for the people that read (and respond to) your blog and possibly buy your magazine.

    You put the time in to write a coherent article.. Responding to a counter argument with “what a lot of rubbish” does not do you, your e zine publication nor the people that view your blog any favors nor does it bring any substance to the table.

    Thanks

    1. Maxisone

      What you and some other internet users fail to grasp is that the ability to comment is a privilege, not a right. Respect is a two-way thing. I have spent a lot of years earning it in the F1 world and being challenged by every Tom, Dick and Harry with an idea and a soapbox can be very tiresome. Every now and then it is necessary to kick away a soapbox. If I had to publish every piece of mindless drivel that I am sent I would have closed the comments down long ago. I published the comment in question but felt it was not rude, but rather just rubbish. If I give someone a voice on my blog, I want that voice to be a relatively sensible one. When you paint the front of your house you do not want some tagger “expressing himself” on your front door.

  38. Joe, you note that if Fernandes wins the rights to use the Team Lotus name, then the only things left to be decided are whether Group Lotus can use Team Lotus’ heritage and the black and gold livery, but isn’t Group Lotus’ premature cancellation of Fernandes’ rights to the Lotus name in F1 (supposed to be a 5-year deal) also at stake, and have the potential for pecuniary remuneration?

    1. Jordan,

      This is a very complicated business and may involve all manner of different elements. It may even involve Team Lotus having to change the name of the chassis from Lotus to Team Lotus. We have to wait and see what happens before we can really judge any of it.

  39. Thanks for the reply Joe – are you planning a write up of the days events and findings at all? Would love to read your views as always

    Best regards

  40. Sawan
    Look at Karens post concerning web domains. The Fernandes jigsaw is nearly complete, the last piece is announcing it to the world.
    Joe
    Fantastic journalism. The stories of recent days are all coming together. By the way doubters, until youve met Tony Fernandes (no matter how briefly) its hard to describe what an impressive and approachable man he is.
    Thanks Joe

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