The root of all evil…

Almost everybody loves live sport. You just never know what is going to happen and it’s often thrilling and uplifting, something different, a high point. Last week, after I got back from Mexico City, I watched the Rugby World Cup final. I knew the result, of course, and that spoiled it for me. The tension was gone. And with it went the excitement. I enjoyed the skills I saw and the heart of the Australians, but is was not live.

Last weekend, by contrast, I went to watch a Top14 rugby game – it’s French rugby’s answer to the Premier League. It was a game between the championship leader Clermont and the last-placed Stade Français, the reigning champions, who won the 2014-2015 title in June – beating Clermont in the final. So, on paper it looked like a game in which pretty much anything could happen. That proved to be the case, with Stade Français getting ahead and then Clermont catching up. The last five minutes were wild as Clermont strove to score a try that would give them victory and Stade Français defended mightily, as their thousands of home fans screamed encouragement. It was great stuff. Brilliant entertainment and sensibly priced. It is true that rugby has now come into money and the rich clubs have an advantage, but this match was what the sport is all about: a battle for victory, using skill and courage.

I long ago stopped watching cycling and athletics after I lost trust in the sport because of all the drug-taking. The latest scandal relating the the Russian federation comes as no surprise at all. I don’t much care for soccer and the FIFA scandals disgust me. In a lot of ways F1 is lucky not be in such messes, but there is still plenty wrong with what we have.

The fundamental problem in all sport is money, or perhaps I should say the people who worship money. Most are very smart people, but they seem to be missing a point: you cannot take it with you. All wealth is utterly meaningless in the face of death. Once one has accumulated sufficient wealth to last a lifetime, it is really only a way to score points – and that warps people.

It is a point that people like Michael Bloomberg, Warren Buffett and Bill Gates seem to understand. They give away billions each year, in the tradition of American steel magnate Andrew Carnegie, who donated about $350 million (which today would be worth around $13.7 billion), almost 90 percent of his fortune, in order to fund the construction of no fewer than 2,509 libraries around the world, believing that education was the most important thing

“The man who dies rich,” he said, “dies disgraced.”

I am saddened by the way the sport is run. Yes, I understand that it is the job of private equity people to make money but for me sport is not business, it is passion and it belongs to no-one. I hate the weakness of the regulator and the sense of entitlement that the big teams have. Have they not got the guts to battle with the smaller teams on a level playing field? And yet, despite all this, we don’t have performance-enhancing drugs. Yes, we have had cheating, but those who cheat are smart enough to know, deep down, that the person who is cheated the most is the cheater, because he or she knows that they are a fraud and that will hurt any intelligent person.

It would be so much better if the commercial rights were exploited by some kind of foundation and that the proceeds distributed to build up the sport globally, rather than being siphoned away. Yes, some of the people would probably steal the money, but at least some of it would be doing some good.

104 thoughts on “The root of all evil…

  1. A fine well written piece that expresses the frustration fans of a lot of major sports are feeling right now. When I heard the news regarding widespread doping in athletics I wasn’t even surprised.
    In my view a sport belongs to those who take part and those who pay to watch. I admire what Bernie has done in F1, the sport is without doubt better for his work but without doubt he’s made enough money. A foundation that took over what he owns could be a wonderful legacy.

    1. Glyn, although I agree in principle with the spirit of Joe’s piece, all those good intentions are undone by the very fans who buy the over-priced merchandising and pay ridiculous prices for attending F1 races. So, I disagree with you and Joe because once you sign a contract, be it for tickets or a T-shirt, you’ve signed away your rights too. CVC would say no one forces a fan to do anything. As for those who take part, I assume you meant the teams, they’re as much to blame as anyone.

          1. It seems to generally be considered a fake… though whoever wrote makes a good point. In the final accounting, money is a minor consideration.

            As a wise(ish) friend of mine always says ‘die in debt… then you’re one up on the b****rds’ – if there is anything left at the end, you should have tried harder.

          2. Good article Joe and I agree entirely with the sentiment. If only there was a simple way to wrestle back the (commercial aspects of the) sport from the clutches of the money men.

            Without meaning to be a complete pedant, but more in the interest of the pursuit of truth and fact, it does appear that the Steve Jobs quote is unfortunately a fake. A shame, because it’s a damned good quote.

            1. How does one know what is fake and what is not? You sent a link to website, I could send a link to another one. How do we know what is right and what is not. In any case, I used the quote in good faith, believing it to be real. Even if it is not real, the sentiment expressed is one that I agree with and so I could simply remove the quote marks and the name Jobs and little would change.

        1. How does one know what is fake and what is not? You sent a link to website, I could send a link to another one. How do we know what is right and what is not. In any case, I used the quote in good faith, believing it to be real. Even if it is not real, the sentiment expressed is one that I agree with and so I could simply remove the quote marks and the name Jobs and little would change.

          1. Regardless of whether or not the quote is a fake or not. The internet now allows anyone to write about any subject as a self-professed ‘expert’. Some of these individuals have zero credibility. Using the internet as a source of truth always carries such risks which is why one should always take anything from it with a pinch of salt (readers and writers).

          2. Joe, snopes.com is a good website for pretty neutral fact checking; they may have covered the Jobs quote. I’m not saying that they always get it right, but they usually do … certainly more often than Fox News 😉

            1. Maybe so, but I do not the website anymore than I knew the source of the quote. I believed it was a bona fide quote and did not feel the need to go and search. I stand corrected and I have corrected the story.

              1. Regardless of who the the quote is from, if it’s a fake claim it as it’s hard to dispute the statement. Another one along the same line that makes sense to me is “I’ve never seen a Hearse with a UHaul behind it” in a nut shell the obvious point that you can’t take it with you. I do think Bernie the ‘money man” should start thinking legacy and start acting in accordance, unless Adrian Newey is building him a time machine otherwise he deserves to have his ashes kept in one of his daughters many designer handbags on a meaningless shelf. Wakey, wakey Bernie please adopt 5% plus of Joe’s passion and loyaylty to the sport that has made you rich beyond your expectation, It’s time to pay the Piper.

                Just a suggestion as a Swan song, one last deal, wrestle the sport away from the leeches and set it up to thrive (no small ask, but what a way to bow out! , the ultimate deal for the deal miastro.)

          3. Joe, there are various debunking websites where you can check. You can start with Snopes.com, or TruthOrFiction.com, or UrbanLegends.com. A man as smart, educated and worldly as you should know to never republish stuff from the Internet, especially when it involves famous people, without cross-checking it first. If you repost something that turns out to be fake, it taints everything else you write.

  2. “And yet, despite all this, we don’t have performance-enhancing drugs.”

    That we know about.

    The subject’s come up once or twice before and the usual response is that there aren’t any drugs that would help in the sport but I’m not so sure about it – In modern times it is a physically strenuous sport and It’s not outside the realms of possibility that something like EPO could help a driver maintain a pace for longer without getting fatigued.

    I;m not saying that I think this is definitely the case, but I think we need to accept it’s a possibility and remain vigilant about it – if we don’t, and assume everything’s fine and the problem dealt with, then that’s how you end up in the situation Cycling and Athletics have got into.

    1. Given the minimal influence of physical performance on car performance (otherwise Jenson would be winning races) I suspect that the benefits are too small compared to the risk of PR scandal. It’d be a potentially career-ending situation.

      That said, the young and desperate might take the gamble until they have a foothold and those who get injured might take shortcuts to recovery.

      1. Given the greater influence that the car has on the performance of a team, any cheating is more likely to be found in terms of flaunting of engineering rules and regulations…and we’ve seen that happen on several instances in recent times. While not remotely close to the kind of state-sponsored cheating that is suggested among the alleged ARFA issues, F1 is hardly a bed of roses.

    2. Funnily enough, performance enhancing drugs were once an accepted part of the sport. Stirling Moss took something prior to his famous Mille Miglia win. All legal then of course. Just one of the many pointless facts I rattling around in my head.

  3. Another good article from yourself. Just a side note that Andrew Carnegie was born in Dunfermline Scotland, he moved to the USA to make his fortune. Dunfermline Town is very fortunate that it wa a big benefactor from Andrew Carnegie when he left a substantial amount of his wealth to the town.

  4. Performance-enhancing drugs?
    Performance-enhancing engines –
    Exclusive access, even if legitimate . . .
    Spoils the spectacle.

    1. New technology is not a drug. It is inevitable with new rules that one party will get ahead of others. They then catch up. That is the story of racing for generations and why rule changes should be kept to a minimum

      1. yes but there is a precedent of teams continually actively flaunting the rule book in an intentional manner..

        – Benetton’s use of an illegal fuel valve and filter to pump more petrol into the car than the legal valve

        – Honda’s use of a hidden fuel tank to use the fuel as an illegal ballast.

        – Spygate – McLaren illicitly collecting and holding information from Ferrari to confer a dishonest and fraudulent sporting advantage

        – Liegate – McLaren misleading the race stewards and contradicting the evidence in Australia 2009 in an attempt to claim 3rd place from Jarno Trulli’s Toyota

        – Crashgate – Renault orchestrating the use of the safety car by Piquet’s timely ‘accident’ to help Alonso win the race

        – Tyrell’s mechanics adding lead balls (as unsecured ballast) alongside the water for their spray injection system late in the race to allow their cars to run illegally lighter for the majority of the race

          1. Appreciate the response Joe – would be grateful if you would divulge which of the above examples of intentional deception is/are erroneous or misleading.

    2. “Performance-enhancing engines –
      … Spoils the spectacle.”

      I believe this is motor racing, where the point is to bring performance out of engines. That IS the spectacle.

      However, I assume you are merely trolling, so, well played…

      1. If you’d bothered to read my reply in full . . .
        You would realise I certainly wasn’t ‘trolling’.
        Focus on the word ‘exclusive’ if that helps.

  5. I know you don’t do much in the way of speculation but what do you think is the most plausible route F1 will take when BCE has the lid finally screwed on (he isn’t the retiring type is he?)?

    He can’t pass on the management to his daughters as they have no interest other than spending the income (brings to mind something Buffett said – “A very rich person should leave his kids enough to do anything but not enough to do nothing.”) There are a lot of people who would like to run F1 but who could actually manage the aquarium that is the ‘Piranha Club’?

      1. A complete outsider or someone with a motorsport background?

        Someone from Indycar, WEC, NASCAR, DTM, BTCC (Alan Gow?) for example?

      2. How do you feel about Tavo? Do you think he would be a good one for the job?

        He seems to have a genuine love of the sport. Do you think he has the other necessary skills?

  6. Wouldn’t it be grand if the teams could compete more equitably on budgets? Then the engineers couldn’t be hoarded and would have money to try out more ideas. I’d also like to be sure the F1 drivers aren’t using drugs intended for attention deficit disorders. Other sports put a premium on concentration, and it’s fascinating to see the consistency of drivers lap after lap. But I suspect it as much as I do the baseball players who have such widespread prescriptions for their convenient disorder.

    1. Take it from someone who has an adderall prescription and has been racing for almost a decade, you would almost certainly perform worse while taking attention deficit stimulants. They reduce your ability to operate smoothly and hyper sensitize your nerves/hearing/vision is a negative way.

      1. How does one know what is fake and what is not? You sent a link to website, I could send a link to another one. How do we know what is right and what is not? In any case, I used the quote in good faith, believing it to be real. Even if it is not real, the sentiment expressed is one that I agree with and so I could simply remove the quote marks and the name Jobs and little would change.

  7. Another great article – but as a slight aside, apart from everything you’ve mentioned, I hate how nobody talks about the positives of the sport. It’s a subject I know you’ve written about before, but today I had a stark reminder:

    I know you don’t like links, so I won’t post it, but there is an article on the BBC News Website today ‘Turbo gives petrol cars a boost as diesel faces backlash’. In it, the writing is talking about turbos, e-turbos, energy recovery systems etc. And there is not one mention of Formula 1.

    It’s not the writer’s fault – he is a business report, he probably doesn’t know about the work being done in F1 at the moment. That’s the fault of the FIA and FOM.

    It’s a slight tangent I know, but it further points out the weaknesses (or perceived weaknesses at least) of the powers that be in regard to promotion, and maintaining a healthy F1.

  8. In a similar vein, MotoGP is now tucked away in the depths of BT Sport, presumably entirely for financial gain. The Phillip Island race produced one of the finest motor sport spectacles of any kind, one that should make Bernie Ecclestone weep. And yet, perversely, coverage in the wider media was almost non-existent. F1 by contrast gets the exposure for a show which on many occasions is, at best, mediocre. For different reasons, neither are sustainable in the long term, which gives cause for hope – something must change.

      1. I tried watching MotoGP and I find it utterly boring. I just can’t get excited about racing motorbikes no matter how “good” the racing is supposed to be. It’s still bikes.

  9. This is an oft repeated dream Joe, to have the rights and the money held by some type of FIA Trust and divided equally amongst the teams.

    The level playing field of equal financial support from within the sport, could then be enhanced by teams individual sponsorship. (After removing tobacco money and booze money)

    Of course in reality if this were to happen we would find that the FIA Trust is a sub-division of Bambino and this too was covered in the original 100 year agreement. (Covering all eventualities, rather like a Sheldon Cooper room mate agreement) .

  10. To be fair the only difference between the corruption in fifa and F1 is that F1 doesn’t try and pretend it isn’t corrupt. It openly admits that it chooses new tracks depending on how much they pay where as FIFA try to pretend it has a fair process when choosing which country gets the world cup using multiple different metrics and not paying people off…

      1. But paying some teams more appearance money than others based on ‘hidden agreements’ and then claiming all teams are being treated fairly is a bit on the thin side..

  11. I remember reading somewhere (possibly even here!) some time ago that all athletes should remember that their blood samples are stored as well as tested and that in the future, testing methods will become more and more advanced.

    Basically, if you took something in 1995, it could take until 2020…but we’ll find you out. It’s hardly surprising that Russian athletes have been rumbled, half of them won’t even know what their trainers are asking them to take and the other half will probably assume it’s legal anyway. I expect that China and all the other countries the west has a grudge against will follow in time.

    1. Don’t know, I’ve never be there. I’m told it is an island in the Atlantic Ocean. However, I think the point that you might be missing is that if enough like-minded individuals get together and try to achieve things, things can be achieved. It is striving for improvement that is worth the effort. It is easy to sit back and be cynical and say “That’s what people are like”. It is far harder to try to make things better.

      1. How can you be part of F1 for x number of years and still believe, however hopefully, that what you’ve written may come to pass?

  12. F1is nothing if not cheating, it’s whole modus operandi it’s to find clever ways to get round the rules to find an advantage. From wobbly floors, leadshot in the tail pipe, extra heavy rear wings to front wings that flex at speed, hidden launch controls and drivers standing on their car post race to lock-out the hinged floor.

    All were done to win and win more money than the next team to afford better engineers who could find more ingenious was to cheat the rules.

    Some misty eyed belief that cheaters just cheat themselves and all the other sports are dirty cheating scum compared to out playful bending of some rules does you a massive disservice.

    More than any other sport on this planet. F1 is about money and making sure you’ve got more of it than the next team. And if that means cheating then damn well make sure you don’t get caught.

    1. Sidewaysbob said: ” and drivers standing on their car post race to lock-out the hinged floor.”

      Ooh, not heard of that one before! Any details?

    1. How does one know what is fake and what is not? You sent a link to website, I could send a link to another one. How do we know what is right and what is not. In any case, I used the quote in good faith, believing it to be real. Even if it is not real, the sentiment expressed is one that I agree with and so I could simply remove the quote marks and the name Jobs and little would change.

  13. good to see you are also a fan of the oval ball joe, my 2 passions also, although I have to say the f1 side has been waning slightly

  14. I agree with Rick, regarding Steve Jobs-s quote.

    I have just come from the practice sessions of the Rotax Max Karting World Championships at the Portimao International Kart Circuit, in Portugal.
    There are 240 drivers and karts all working alongside one another in 2 huge marquee tents, nothing hidden. There are 4 different classes using 3 different chassis, Sodi, Birel and Praga BUT all with Rotax engines for each of the classes..
    The organisation is beyond belief, oh and by the way, Entry is FREE.

  15. Formula One has come a long way since the days of teams based in small Surbiton lock-up garages.

    Perhaps some shares in F1PLC could be made available to fans and teams, (but definitely no pension funds, investment banks, venture capitalists, etc)
    so we have a vested interest in the sport, that, alas for some, also happens to be a business.

  16. Drug taking in F1 wouldn’t have the same effect as in Athletics because the driver isn’t the engine. It would be the same as using illegal fuels or any other gismo that gives more power through a means outside of the rules.

    In my opinion people that cheat in any sport through any means for the sake of making more money, or false glory are in the same category.

    It is such a shame that sports are tarnished by these things, as at grass roots level, I watch my daughter several times a week training at the local athletics club just to knock a fraction of a second from her personal best and at that level, at least, it is probably the purest form of sport.

  17. I worked in F1 for a number years and one of the primary reasons I left was that it had become dominated by far too many people who had come down with the “illness” of making money. While there are many dedicated and passionate people working in F1, the sport is no longer driven by passion. This is a shame.

    Good story Joe.

  18. I appreciate your sentiments and, as been stated by other posters, they are shared by a great many who love this sport.

  19. For future reference, snopes.com is the chief internet debunker/confirmer of what is true or false in the ether.

  20. This is the second time you have mentioned watching rugby in recent posts which interests me as it is the only other sport that competes with F1 for my attention.

    Sadly money increasingly determines the outcome of the oval ball game at club or regional level. However, it does not always translate to international success.

    The French Top-14 is cash laden and consequently stuffed full of expensive imports. Whilst here in Wales we have no money, salary caps and player exodus. Yet France completely capitulated to the All Blacks in the quarter finals. A 50 point margin broke all records for that stage of the tournament.

    Likewise, the English game has a lot of cash and thrives at club level. Yet in the RWC England lost a game that they should have won (to an injury decimated Wales) and then were taken apart by the Aussies and failed to even make the quarters.

    So perhaps cash is a double edged sword?

  21. It’s all about the sport…and the money. Motorsport is expensive!

    Karting, regarded as the grass roots of motorsport by most, is expensive.
    I have personally witnessed vast over spends in the search for speed.

    Disproportionate sums of money spent by individuals that can ill afford it in attempt to propel their offspring towards the front of the grid.

    I have seen young “Johnny” and his family arrive with an old kart strapped to the roof of their average family car full of excitement and happiness. A relatively short time later the family car is now a luxury motorhome, the kart is brand new, The excitement has been ruined by the pressure on “Johnny” to perform and the debt has taken care of the happiness.

    They say money cannot buy you happiness and it’s a sad fact that like Steve Jobs death bed confession, it seems, that for some at least, realisation is a very late visitor.

  22. I think you can watch cycling again, as the mass doping days are long over. There is still the very occasional instance in the depths of the peleton but it generally seems to be clean.

  23. Two points,

    Firstly, I would be happy with FOM if they actually promoted races. Skimming obscene sums of money from despots is one thing, but the sport desperately needs to be big in the USA. So why they can’t let local partners invest in the circuits and just demand a turn-up fee to cover their costs for the first 10 years. Somehow Soccer has managed to make an impact against American football. But this promoter would be content to let classic races fall by the wayside, provided there is a fast buck to be taken elsewhere in the world.

    Secondly, I also love international Rugby. I was pretty certain before kick-off that the All Blacks would win, but it was a hell of a game to watch them achieve the win. After Malaysia this year I predicted that the WDC would be HAM, ROS, VET and the WCC would Mercedes, Ferrari and Williams. It has never really looked like anything but that, but the inevitable outcome of 19 rounds has hardly been gripping.

    As for Manor taking up the mantle of a plucky Stade Français and taking the fight to Mercedes, well that just smacks of an unlevel playingfield. But the referee has taken a bribe to keep his whistle firmly in his pocket. Money talks.

  24. The problem within the F1 industry is that few look outside of their cocoon to the real everyday world.

    Once you’re in the cocoon and enjoying the benefits, very few want out of it.

    Same in the Film/Movie world where fiction and reality blur. I had 6 years in film and TV and was glad to be our of it, but I missed the money and the side benefits.

  25. It’s funny how everyone assumes that only the driver might benefit from enhanced performance drugs, as if there aren’t dozens of crew members with much more grueling schedules and physically demanding jobs pushing hard to meet absolute deadlines and performance metrics. What’s to say that Red Bull doesn’t have a special formula it puts in the cans they give their race teams on a weekend? Obviously the teams have dietitians and nutritionists on staff to manage overall health, and they eat team meals, etc. It’s not entirely crazy, and it doesn’t have to be tooters of methamphetamine handed out to the tire guys to be unethical and possibly against the spirit, if not letter, of the sporting rules. Is it wrong if the team provides a doctor that has no problem writing prescriptions for controlled drugs to help them through a serious case of jet lag? Where is the line there?

    As for the drivers – there is no doubt that enhanced physical abilities, endurance/stamina, and overall fitness are all factors in on-track performance. When Schumi came back, if you recall, there was a lot of talk about his age, but because of his fitness level and years of exercise, he was still competitive – and there’s something to be said for him still being alive today after his accident because of his long-term health routines as an F1 driver.

    Just trying to get some other ideas out there. What, I wonder, will happen on the day that humans start to hybridize themselves with the tech we continue to develop. Will we limit artificial implants? Will we require ‘original’ body parts, or restrict the kind of data drivers will be able to access (because, let’s face it, one of the first things humans will perfect is an integrated net/web portal so we can twitter and wiki in real-time all the time)? It’s still a few years out but the impact on motorsport could be immense. Imagine stuffing all the data the teams have now into the driver’s brain in real time, letting them not just feel but see the car performance…and I think I’ve got the plot for my next unfinished novel. Off to the coffehouse!

  26. It’s the FIAs job to look after everyone involved in F1. When the FIA were forced to give away the commercial side of F1, they had an obligation to ensure everyone had a fair share of the pot. Instead, the FIA took the £300m and let Bernie do what he wanted with the income. That was wrong in so many ways.
    I fail to see any difference between those arrangments and what has allegedly occurred in athletics and football

  27. The root of all evil is not the people who worship money, or is it the money. It Is ‘the worship of money’ (not the people who worship the money), an important distinction. At least if one were to reference the original concept of “the root of all evil” in Paul’s writings.

      1. At least religion has an expectation of some morality and self contemplation, likely beneficial. Are we better served with it being replaced by rampant mindless consumerism and marketing..the new religion? Sorry Joe off the F1 topic, gotta defend peoples right to believe as it involves sacrifice, discipline and commitment. Not bad traits that in my opinion should not be looked down upon or dismissed.

  28. Hi Joe
    As this scandal broke, I wondered to myself about the potential for similar brown paper bags given to the blazer brigade in my favourite sport. With the sport moving to less democratic countries without strong corporate governance, I hope the sport is not the next domino to fall.

  29. The quote isn’t “fake”, it has simply been attributed to the wrong person; an easy thing to happen. The words have power (and an inherent compassion) whoever said them.

    I read that after Carnegie’s death a note was found in his hand which said “I am going to spend the first half of my life making money and the second half giving it away”. That may also be fake ~ but I like it.

  30. Bernie has his altruistic and charitable side. From the billions he has accumulated he has donated literally hundreds of millions to his two daughters, who have in turn invested it in breast implants and vast mansions located in all the smartest places around the world.

    I read a few weeks ago that one of the daughters used some of the money to employ dozens of needy London builders to construct a façade replicating an alpine lodge across the front of her property – just for a party. Never mind the fact that it was all torn down afterwards or that Ecclestone actually owns such a lodge in Switzerland.

    This is where your £300 GP tickets and SkySports subscriptions go folks. It’s clearly a different world from the benevolence of Gates and Buffet but as they say “Charity begins at home”

  31. I see that COTA has lost a few million from the Texas government annual subsidy. Coupled with horrific rains and the allure of a new race in Latin America, this spells big time trouble for COTA. It makes me wonder if COTA and its investors could reorganize themselves as a not-for-profit entity, similar to BRDC and Silverstone. Then wealthy race fans could make charitable contributions to help foster the sport.

  32. Good story. I hope something can be developed to further the interest of the sport. However, I worry about the demographics.

  33. Andrew Carnegie is hardly the shining paradigm of magnanimity.Sure he gave away his fortune which benefited educational access. But how many thousands of people suffered in his mills and plants because he wouldn’t pay a living wage with decent working hours or conditions? All in the interest of accumulating the wealth he would later give away. And his partner Frick never gave away anything and caused the death of thousands in the Johnstown damn failure and flood.

    In short, how you make it is just as important as how much you give away, if not more so.

    Sorry Joe, not a lot to do with F1 in there, but I couldn’t hold back.

    Thank you.

    1. Someone who gives away that much money is not a paradigm of magnanimity? Holy cow! What does he have to do to make it in your eyes?

      1. I thought I tried to explain that in my comment. Great, he gave it away, but society in general would have been better off if he hadn’t been such a rogue and scoundrel while accumulating his wealth.

        Seriously, thanks for listening. You always mange to come up with stimulating and topical references in your posts!

  34. In the end you can take nothing with you, so if that makes money meaningless it would make everything meaningless.

    By the way, “you can’t take it with you” is what a lot of people say, it is true of course and life is meaningless anyway 🙂

Leave a comment