Wow… This time of year one is really rolling with the punches in Formula 1. Three races in four weekends – and a lot of folk did not go home between Austria and Britain. A lot also went to Goodwood, so they have had no time off at all. After the secret promotional event in London last week I had a busy weekend at Silverstone (always busier than other Grands Prix as one knows more people) and then on Monday morning I headed off for Dover to get the boat home, Eurotunnel being prohibitively expensive – and less agreeable – at this time of year. If you pay a little extra on the ferry and get access to the club and priority boarding, the P&O ferry can be great. There is something comfortingly old-fashioned about the Peninsular & Orient and if one can leave all the school coach parties downstairs, it’s really rather enjoyable. There was even a sundeck on this trip…
The drive down to Paris that followed was fairly swift, although someone who had not listened to Jean Todt, managed to have an accident big enough to involve a helicopter landing on the motorway. Fortunately, I was listening to autoroute radio and was I was able to get off the road before I arrived at the closed section and got stuck in a jam. Thus a detour for a few kilometres of French countryside near Abbeville was agreeable enough and then it was back on the fast road. The reason to rush home was to do with summer holidays for small people and the last few days have been all about opening up a house, blowing-up paddling pools, dealing with plumbing, cutting back jungle and so on. These are all things that get lost in the 24/7 lifestyle that is Formula 1.
However, the green notebook was there, leering at me, a reminder that F1 life goes on as well. I did get an email from the FIA, which caused my heart to sink. The decision has been taken to use the halo head protection system in 2018. I consider this to be utterly foolish for the sport. It has come about because in the summer of 2016 the sport voted to do something about head protection. A year on, no other system has been sufficiently researched and so we are stuck with the halo, but because there was a commitment to do something, failing to do so might have created grounds for a negligence claim and so the halo has been pushed through. One hopes that this is just a phase and that the hideous halo will soon disappear and be replaced by something sexier. I am all for protecting the drivers, but not to a ridiculous extent that threatens to damage the sport because the halo looks so awful. Millions of people play sport every day, and, inevitably, some suffer injury or pain. Most players and spectators accept this risk. You cannot ban dangerous sports because otherwise it would be done illegally and be more dangerous and so one must accept that some people want to take risks and are aware of the possible outcomes. Racing drivers know that they can die (even if they don’t REALLY consider the possibility). Danger is the thing that is popular. The F1 machines today are incredibly safe. They have been for a long time. Yes, there are still risks and flying wreckage is definitely important but where is the limit? People have a choice if they go racing, they sign a whole series of waivers and the reality is that very few accidents that occur in the normal course of racing give rise to a claim of negligence. If there is deliberate disregard for the rules or if nothing has been done to solve a known problem then there are possible claims, but there must a line drawn somewhere. And I think the halo is too much, it’s just plain ugly. F1 cars should be sleek and sexy and the shield is far better in that respect. I hope that the halo gets thrown out quickly and the shield can take over before the fans start walking away.
The key point about F1 is that people want to watch gladiators. They don’t want whingers who have to have the day off if they break a toenail. They want heroes. The other day, for example, Alexander Albon, one of Britain’s rising stars, suffered a broken collarbone after end-over-ending while training when his mountain bike hit some exposed roots. A collarbone is not easy (as we saw some year back with Juan Pablo Montoya), but Albon was back in action three weeks after the shunt (about half the normal recovery time). That was heroic.
F1 stars throwing wobblies, and behaving like primadonnas, whining on the radio to Charlie and so on, does not help the image of the sport… Nor does the halo.
Anyway, back to the notebook. There is, first of all, a note about how pleasant it is to be back in Middle England, a place where things have not changed so much, in bucolic backwaters with daft names, garden fetes, pony clubs and all the rest of it. Silverstone is still just an overgrown airfield, the child of the austere post-war age, but it is still a great place and to see the 2017 cars going through Becketts at full tilt is impressive. As I said before, the sport is all about heroes, doing things the rest of us cannot do…
I realized on the ferry home that I had not read a newspaper for days and had no idea what was happening in the world outside F1. Tut-tut. I was delighted to see that the Conservatives in the UK are now beginning to slit one another’s throats over Brexit and there are more and more warnings. A Japan-EU trade deal is deemed to be a threat to the British car trade… and so on. I noticed with interest that McLaren is expanding a facility it has at IDIADA in Spain, where it tests its road cars, and I could not help but wonder whether future engineers will have EU contracts, rather than GB ones… It’s a sensible hedge in case things get worse.
I saw also that Roger Federer had won Wimbledon for an eighth time, which pushed Lewis’s fifth British GP win off the back pages. What can you do?
The major chat in F1 circles at the moment is all about engines and it is getting interesting. Sauber seemed to have the basis of a deal with Honda (it was announced by Honda and they tend not to be silly) but the word is that in order to get Frédéric Vasseur Sauber has had to agree to switch engines. Fred might like Mercedes and he is very close to Toto Wolff, but it seems that the F1 Commission needs to give permission for more than three supplies and one can see that this will never happen. The F1 Commission cannot agree on whether to open a window, let alone rules and regulations.
Given the political power of Mercedes (in terms of votes) one can see Renault and Ferrari wanting few Mercedes teams and more teams with their engines to give them more political clout. So Sauber will need to stay with Ferraris next year, probably 2018 versions of the engine, and the word is that F2 rising star and Ferrari protégé Charles Leclerc will be snapped to drive. Pascal Wehrlein will move on, which is probably sensible…
This means that McLaren’s only choice is to stay with Honda, or switch to Renault. No-one wants to see Honda kicked out of F1, least of all Honda, and the word is that the Japanese firm may do a deal with Toro Rosso (or perhaps even buy the team) so that they can remain in F1 until they can get the engines up to speed. Red Bull needs only insert a clause in any Toro Rosso deal saying that Red Bull Racing can have the units if they become competitive and Red Bull’s engine problems would be solved. It is a big if, but it is better than drifting on as is now happening. I have heard that there is still no real contract between Red Bull and Renault because of discussions over oil companies and so on, but going straight to Honda would be a bit radical so letting Toro Rosso take the pain, or selling the team (which Red Bull has wanted to do for a while) makes sense. That would mean McLaren with Renault engines, which would be just about OK, even if it would be a bit of a risk for the Renault team. Still, they are getting beaten at the moment by Red Bull, and sometimes Toro Rosso, so clearly they need to improve. Would a McLaren-Renault be sufficient to keep Fernando Alonso? Does he have any other real choices?
Fred Vasseur going to Sauber is a brave move for him, but given the time he took to negotiate the deal, it is fair to say that he must have got pretty much everything he wanted. He will, no doubt, get a flat in Zurich and live there a lot of the time, but he will also spend time back in his native France, where the wine and cheese is better (for a Frenchman). One would suggest that he has also been given the choice of engineers and drivers he wants. The owners of the team are awfully keen to point out that there is no favouritism towards Marcus Ericsson. They were so keen to point this out that they recently had a meeting for the whole team to explain that the evil media was making up stories about favouritism. The odd thing is that Wehrlein was not there. Some say he was not invited, but maybe he just forgot and spent the day shopping in Migros… It was all a bit odd really.
It will still not be easy to get the best engineers in Switzerland but that will be down to Fred’s ability to bring in the heavy-hitters. One expects that he has also had financial guarantees to pay for his plans, or at the very least he has the right to find money on his own account, if the mysterious owners do not want to pay more than they must. Fred has some cred in F1 circles, but it remains to be seen if this is enough.
Has McLaren finally decided to split with Honda? Who can say? But it is fair to say that the team has given the Japanese firm plenty of chances to improve. I would guess that there are two design teams busy in Woking, one for one engine, the other for the other. A decision must come back September. Going to Renault is not a great option for Woking, but it would be better than where the team is now and my feeling is that in 2021 the team will have its own engines . McLaren is already making its own road car power units and it is only logical to go down this path in the future. That will add to the value as and when there is a McLaren IPO is 2022 or 2023.
Elsewhere the rumours of the sale of Force India have increased with the suggestion at Silverstone that this summer Austria’s Andreas Weißenbacher will become the new force in the team. Vijay Mallya may stay on as a minority shareholder but it is clear that Subrata Roy of the Sahara Group is going to give up his shares to raise money to keep the Indian courts from sending him back in jail. At the moment Roy’s empire is gradually being taken apart by the Indian authorities and his property is now being auctioned. Selling his 42.5 percent share in Force India would help raise a decent sum and Weißenbacher might also buy out the Mol family in Holland, which were involved in the team in its days as Spyker, which still owns 15 percent. No doubt, if Mallya keeps his shares, there will be options for Weißenbacher to buy them as well.
Who is this Weißenbacher character? An Austrian. He owns the BWT brand and sees F1 as a good way to promote his water products. The company has revenues of $650 million and earnings of around $10 million per annum, which is not much in F1 terms, but Mallya has run the team for between $10-20 million a year (thanks to his prize money and cash from sponsors). BWT began sponsorship in motorsport in 2015 with a DTM car for Austrian Lucas Auer. The programme expanded to two cars in 2016 and this year funds Auer and Edoardo Mortara.
Auer, the son of Gerhard Berger’s sister Claudia, is currently fighting for the DTM title with Audi’s Mattias Ekström and will take part in the upcoming Hungaroring F1 test for Force India and, if all goes well, he could replace Perez in 2018 if he gets a superlicence. Auer is 22 and finished fourth in the F3 European Championship in 2013 and 2014 before switching to DTM.
Gene Haas uses F1 to sell his machine tools and so there is no reason why Weißenbacher would not do the same with his filtration, demineralisation and lime-scale protection products. He also manufactures metering pumps and distillation devices and is in the process of building up new business in the development of membranes for automotive fuel cells. And, of course, being an Austrian, he can always get advice from Toto Wolff…
The suggestion that Perez may depart Force India (under its new name) is fairly simple. He’s under pressure these days from Esteban Ocon. He does not want to stick around and get beaten as Ocon gets better and better. Perez could go to Williams next year (taking his sponsors with him) or he could get an offer from Renault, which wants Ocon back, but cannot get him. Perez and Hulkenberg has been a good combination in the past…
We’ll see how it pans out, but this was the gossip at the old airfield.
joeblogsf1 
great colour as ever Joe. Thanks.
Peninsular and Oriental, Joe…. I’m sure there’s never a pedant around when you need one.
Your stealing my title, ‘spect ’twas the computer !
Joe , McLaren do not make thrown road car engines/PU’s . The are manufacturer by Ricardo plc ( based on an old Nissan design ) but licensed under the McLaren name, On the head protection my personal opinion is I don’t think either the Shield or the Halo is a good idea at all and that an all new solution should be come up with. The Halo is too cumbersome and fiddly and the Shield could cause it’s own problems -i.e be too reflective and glaring n very low sunlight/artificial light and lead to reduced visibility in wet conditions which could be dangerous.
Thanks Joe I always enjoy your green notebook posts. Most interesting and insightful as always.
agree always happy to read Joes road trips and the news. Hope you have a nice wee break to recharge. Keep up the good work Joe.
…. “replaced by something sexier”
To some the halo does indeed look sexy as it strongly resembles the G string that dancers wear at the Paris Crazy Horse strip joint.
I am told it is the last item said dancers take off, and so it will prove with F1. I have no doubt that this device will disappear within the first season of its endorsement.
maybe even after the first race!
Joe,
I have just finished reading Jeffery Quill’s autobiography covering the years, where he was Supermarine’s principal test pilot. In the early combat days of the Spitfire, the pilots were complaining of a very similar phenomenon to Vettel with the Shield, nausea from looking out through the curved Perspex (Plexiglass) canopy. It was cured by fitting two extra flat armoured glass panels at the side, adjoining the straight ahead (aiming) panel already present. It would seem that the brain can cope with the angles between two or more flat panels but not the distortion that occurs on curved panels. It should not be difficult to mould a shield with a flat front pane and two flat side panels to each side of the front panel. They could even be made from armoured safety glass. After all if they can stop a 7.92mm bullet at 2500 feet per second, bits of another car should be no problem.
That’s really interesting, Wilson…
The problem with my suggested solution is that it would be terminally ugly.
I like that, thats really interesting
That sounds really interesting, although I’m not sure how much they can see to the sides in that cockpit.
So F1, the pinnacle of auto-motive technology, cannot match the innovation of wartime solutions to problems large and small…..
Necessity is the mother of invention. Wartime advances took 20 years to be matched at the sedentary pace of more normal life.
The requirements for frontal protection should be regulated not the precise design, something worthwhile would soon come along. Neither of the present proposals seem more than stopgaps.
With the shield there were going to be problems with light polarisation too.
On the Lanc the tail gunners used to have take out the panel completely, thus the “clear view” panel was invented ie nothing, but that’s another story.
Jack Brabham tried a type of canopy, open at the top for entry/exit, in the ’60s
at Monza, I think. His was absolutely for streamlining but it was abandoned because of the same vision problems mentioned by the pilots and Vettel.
Pasty Burt used to run with something very similar in sprint events too (I think there’s a photo at her Wikipedia page), although running solo on a track is likely quite a different proposition to hustling a car in a pack.
I shook my head in disbelief about the adoption of the halo. How much safer can F1 be without taking away the things that make it watchable? Some of these drivers want it both ways. You can’t expect to get paid millions of pounds a year if there isn’t an element of real danger present. F1 is the pinnacle of motorsport. Only the most skilful and brave should in the cars.
You know that, we know that but I consider the FIA unfit for pupose so we should not be surprised.
And yet, how would you react if your favourite driver happened to be seriously injured whilst on track? Would you just accept it as “one of those things that can happen” and just continue on as before, or would you demand that changes should happen? I cannot help but feel that, for all the bravado from some fans, they want the appearance of danger but simultaneously don’t want to accept the actual consequences of that anger.
As an aside, Joe, I hope that you do not consider this rude but I find the tone of your article to be rather at odds with your previous attitude to the sport. You have written in the past about how many were too quick to adopt an overconfident attitude of “disaster can’t happen now”, and chided others who rejected safety innovations just because of aesthetics by reminding them of the benefits that they brought about – the attitude you have taken in this article, where you have looked solely at the negatives and based your complaints heavily on aesthetics, flies in the face of the position that you have normally taken in the past.
Well I would accept it anon – shame you didn’t use your name given you seem to have definite views.
Indeed, what are the positives if the most recent incidents in Formula 1 would have had the sane result.
The truth is there are none, but this just moves the danger which will always exist elsewhere
Only a flat in Zurich for Vasseur? surely he could have insisted on a twelve room town house …
And each room containing a bowl of M&Ms with all the brown ones removed as Van Halen used to include in their contract rider.
They only used to to that to see if the promoter had read and followed their rider – which included many things to guarantee the safety of fans in the venue. If the brown M&Ms were there, then the band knew the rider had not been read and neither had the safety demands been met.
That was done for reasons of data gathering. It was very shrewd (& not just an example of rock stars being knobs, as it’s usually presented).
But do you know *why* that was included in the rider?
For anyone who doesn’t – it was purely a very way to check whether the contract rider had actually been adhered to.
If any brown M&Ms were present then the crew were instructed to check everything *very* carefully as it was possible if not likely that technical requirements in the rider may have been overlooked as well.
A great read as usual, Joe! Thank you.
This halo decision is nonsense.
The 2017 regulations were designed to make the cars sexier and now they decide this?
Huge shot in the foot.
Like the qualifying debacle of two years ago, this is set to be scrapped fairly early in the season …
out of the coat hanger, into the halo…
so much for improving the way the cars looked.
Also, is it anything more than just a coincidence that Ferrari unsuccessfully tested the screen and were the only team to be in favour of the halo?
thanks!
RE: Halo Effect.
Every word you write on the subject is absolutely on the nail, Joe. I’ve said elsewhere that Todt and his cohorts are killing the golden-egg the F1 goose
still lays in plenitude for us all. Danger, inherent and considered, is what speed sports are all about. The open cockpit cleared face of the driver is already
a thing of the past. The full helmet and visor have seen to that.
OK…..these things were and are life savers, but the next step takes us to
fully enclosed cockpits because that is the only way F1 is going to eliminate
all danger. And the danger is a vital part of the F1 package.
If it’s made utterly free of danger F1 as a spectacle dies. As others have pointed out, the huge following the Isle of Man TT races attracts every single year isn’t caused bythe pretty countryside the race runs through. It’s caused
by human beings sitting astride 200mph machines and driving flat through the narrow twisting, dry-stone walled canyon that is The Mountain Course. You make a tiny error at any point and you are dead. It’s as bleakly honest as that.
I’m quite aware that many people don’t see F1 in that light. But I will
maintain that if you remove all danger you will destroy the greatest motor sport
show on this planet. And the Halo is a seriously wrong move in that direction.
+1 – I’m not sure why Joe used the cycling analogy of danger when motorsport itself has plenty of contemporary examples in other categories of the competitors being perceived to be ‘superhuman’ due to the risks they take. F1 in contrast is sanitized to the point of the drivers and teams appearing hypersensitive to any notion of danger these days.
If they they need to be doing something, the F1 / FIA would be better off funding safety improvements in lower formula where there are still higher safety risks than increasing their already ludicrous levels of safety.
re: the above True. If a sport ceases to have any danger, it becomes simply a past time. It would be barbaric to require them to face the same level of danger they did in ’70s and before. However, we’ve long since reached the point in F1 where serious injury /death can occur in anything but freak circumstances.
P&O was formerly the Peninsular & Oriental steam navigation company Joe. No Pacific involved! 🙂
And where is the said peninsula? I presume spain?
Yes, the Iberian peninsular, apparently.
I’d always vaguely assumed it was a reference to one of Hong Kong and Singapore. Quite wrongly, if wikipedia is correct.
Joe, in F1 Racing with the interview with Claire Williams this month, Perez asks the question, can I race for you? Is this a deal already in the offing? And is Felipe is hanging his F1 hat up? – where is the next Brazilian coming from?
Wow. Great update, some complexities popping out. Many thanks.
(Peninsular & Orient)…..
Thanks for taking the time for such an in depth notebook while preparing for the ankle biters.
Sadly, I completely agree it is hideous, the halo is the only option open to them in case there is a freak incident.
Do your sources tell you that McLaren are definitely splitting with Honda as I, with very little to based it on, sense they might stay as there are signs of it all coming together on the engine side of things.
Once again thanks
Thanks for the notebook Joe, they are always eagerly awaited. Totally, totally agree with you about the halo.
Joe, surely Peninsular and Oriental (Steam Navigation Company)
Hi Joe,
I couldn’t agree more with your comments on the dreaded Halo introduction. The thought of F1 cars running next season with an inverted lavatory seat bolted on to them is appalling! Surely sense will prevail and time can be put into further research or rectification of the Shield issues that the ever moaning Vettel said was unusable at Silverstone? As you say, these guys well understand the risks (which are minimal theses days compared to their illustrious predecessors) and should get on with job of driving in the most prestigious racing series on earth?!
McLaren don’t make there’s own engines. They bought the I.P. off of Menard (what was left of TWR at Leafield) it was then developed, passed on to Mahle for the next phase then finally to Ricardo who manufacturer them. McLaren online developed the chassis.
*only not online and their not there’s. Autocorrect!
They do make their own engines. What they are based on is not the issue.
Having nearly tripped over an old Nissan group C unit at Ricardo in Shoreham a few years back, the key point is that McLaren own the IP to the design.
My understanding is that there are almost no parts (if any) interchangeable between the two designs (Nissan/McLaren).
The other point is that as I understand it, the difficult bit isn’t the ICE but the rest of the powertrain technology, much of which McLaren has already had developed for cars like the P1.
In the past the main impediment to a McLaren F1 engine wasn’t technology. You can usually hire the right people to do that-if you are willing to do so. It’s the finance of the continued development of the engine that is difficult.
If McLaren make their own engines, what is Ricardo’s role in the process? (Truly hope we’re not going to find ourselves in a debate over the semantics over the words ‘make’ versus ‘manufacture’).
Manufacturing is not the same as designing..,
If they own the IP, it’s their engine.
Cosworth apparently looking at 2021 – what chances they and mclaren hook up?
Very little
Are the stories about favouritism at Sauber made up?
I don’t know… but the owner is very touchy on the subject
Bear with sore head!
Come on Joe, if it was your team, you would defend it like you would your own son.
I wouldn’t own an F1 team…
Marcus will have to keep it off the barriers long enough for the team to work it’s magic…
I echo your thoughts on the halo; it’s just horrible.
But I can cope with the ugliness; the real problem, I think, is that this is simply not the right answer. The reality is that there are a vanishingly small number of occasions where the halo would actually help. Sure, if something really massive (like a wheel) comes at you then it has obvious benefits, but how often in recent F1 history has this actually occurred? Even then, what do you do if it drops on top of the driver’s head, or comes at a sideways angle?
I’m not sure it would have done anything to help Massa with the infamous flying suspension component, nor Justin Wilson, and although one can argue that it would have saved Bianchi’s life, his father sounded less than convinced.
It’s good to bring safety to motorsport, but this seems to be more of a liability cover than a genuine step forward.
There’s no way that the halo would have saved Bianchi’s life. In all probability it could have lessened the injuries sustained by Henry Surtees…
The McLaren Renault deal is done and will be announced in Hungary
“The McLaren Renault deal is done and will be announced in Hungary”
sure I heard that in 1992…
Guess that we all missed that announcement this weekend Jim.
He’s right but it hasn’t been announced
Now that is a notebook, we need more races at Silverstone to give you lots of material…. So Joe is your thinking that McLaren will do there own engine now that R. D. is gone. I recall he was very against this route in the past and insisted you needed big manufacturer involvement. All would be confirmed if smart engine people start getting contracted. I think the Honda experiment confirms that at least the Japanese big manufacturer involvement is more of a liability than benefit. Better with the Merc supporting the little specialist guys approach (Ilmor, Brixton), so what is the chance that Cosworth facilities becomes McLaren? I recall that McLaren uses someone else in the UK for the road car engines, maybe them???
In 2021 it makes sense… not before
I am long aching to hear from true authoritative investigation, what is the possibility of a open source style of engine design.
I agree with Adam completely on the hope for multiplication of small specialists, I hope too providing supply to a Mclaren keen to offer their customers novel, British built power. Not for nationalistic reasons, but the nurturing of the scope of talents we luckily behold.
I dint know why they don’t say you got x amount of energy get it how you want e.g electric,petrol or both and go. Racing…..
It’s an attractive idea. But without a budget/resource cap the big manufacturers would spend billions trying (or at least modelling) every promising solution.
Sent from my iPad
>
Gotcha! The rumored Apple iF1 ICE
They must be up to something…
Nah, it will be the new Intel-BMW i7…
I love it. What a great post. McLaren-Renault just doesn’t seem right…
P&O: “Peninsular and Oriental” surely!?
Yep, my mistake
Hair splitting……actually it was always ‘Pensinsular and Orient’
……no ‘al’ involved in those grand old shipping titles…….
Have you read The Man who caught Crippen?
P&O is Peninsular & Oriental – the peninsular being that of Spain and Portugal when the company first got a mail contract in 1834
Love your newsletters – so much info.
Gordon Jones, ex P&O navigator and GT40 fanatic
Quite right. Frazzled brain…
Didn’t P&O sponsor a British Formula Ford championship way back when?
Correct. Tommy Byrne, Jonathan Palmer, Robert Moreno, Johnny Dumfries and some bloke called Senna all graduated to F1.
Townsend-Thoresen also backed one of the big championships for young FF1600 drivers.
Thanks, Phil
Hi Joe,
What do you think the chances are of Honda buying toro Rosso?
We will see…
Joe, if FIA think that the HALO is so great why isn’t it mandated on F2 and F3 cars? These are the F1 drivers of the future and seem to crash more than F1 drivers.
I thought that Ricardo designed the McLaren engines , basically from a clean sheet of paper , and produced them at Shoreham
Ricardo manufacture them
Ricardo was a very well respected Engineering consultancy even before Bruce McLaren was born. They make Ron’s (as was) operation look like ‘Johnny come Latelys’. If you do a bit more research Joe, I think you will find that Ricardo do rather more than just manufacturing McLaren’s engines.
An extract from their website;
Ricardo plc
We are a global strategic engineering and environmental consultancy that specialises in the transport, energy and scarce resources sectors.
Our work extends across a range of market sectors – including passenger cars, commercial vehicles, rail, defence, motorsport, energy and environment – and we are proud to possess a client list that includes transport operators, manufacturers, energy companies, financial institutions and government agencies.
Through our multi-industry knowledge and deep technical expertise, we are uniquely positioned to handle our clients’ toughest strategic and operational challenges, with assignments that have included strategy development, cost reduction, safety management, regulatory compliance and environmental impact assessments.
In addition to our technical consultancy services, we have in-house engineering capabilities that enable us to design and deliver high-quality prototypes and low-volume manufacturing of complex products and assemblies, including engines, transmissions, electric motors and generators, battery packs and fuel cell systems.
And, across everything we do, in every assignment we undertake, we remain committed to the ethos of our founder, Sir Harry Ricardo, one of the most innovative engineers of his time, who in 1915 set out on a mission to ‘maximise efficiency and eliminate waste’.
I did plenty of research. The engine is based on design that was used by Nissan as the Infiniti IRL engine and later for the abortive Nissan LMP1 but it has been greatly modified over the years by McLaren.
“greatly modified over the years by McLaren.” with the design and manufacture carried out by Ricardo on behalf of McLaren.
McLaren have in depth expertise in the electronics but I doubt they have the in house skills for the mechanical/electrical aspects of the engine.
McLaren, as the old Lotus company did, act as consultants to many big names in the automotive world, but are clever enough to bring in help with projects that they can’t handle themselves. They go to Ricardo.
I think the point with McLaren owning the IP now and having (/paid for having) done plenty of development on it, that means that the Engine design is McLarens, regardless of who did large chunks of developing it with their money, making it a McLaren engine.
Joe, out of curiosity: do you have any idea why McLaren chose this particular engine as a base?
Because it was there?
Likely true, but not terribly inspiring. I realise that McLaren’s resources are limited, but I still like to imagine that their products are a little less compromised than that. Perhaps I’m deluding myself.
I think the original Nissan/TWR design is related to the engine that Mark Blundell set a famously fast pole lap at Le mans in 1990. So it wasn’t short of power reputedly over 1000bhp in GpC trim..
(As an aside, isn’t the TWR-Nissan the 1997 R390? I thought the 1990 R90 car had Lola and Ray Mallock input, although both seem to have derivatives of the same engine anyway)
Not intending a criticism of the engine, I’m not well enough informed to have an opinion. Just responding to Joe’s suggestion that availability was a (the?) big factor…
Surely Lola and Ray Mallock would have had only chassis input?
I meant Nissan/TWR only in that it was originally the Nissan Group C unit, IP bought by TWR and then by McLaren
I have great respect for Ricardo but that lot sounds like the creation of a fancy London PR agency.
brexit is one of the best things to happen to the UK, especially economically. The only real warnings, aside from the media lies and distortions, is how much trouble the EU is in and will be in when the UK can compete with it without all the crazy restrictions. Additionally…the UK will be thanking its lucky stars that it got out when it did so it is not stuck holding the bag when the EU falls completely apart in the not-so-distant future
I do not agree. I think it is foolish
Utter twaddle James. Sorry to say you are wrong – Brexit has already pushed up inflation and that hits us all in our pockets. We are all poorer right now – let alone in 2-4 years time when the axe falls. The EU is already stronger with Macron winning a landslide on a strong pro – EU ticket, so quite honestly your waffle and distortion doesn’t hold much sway.
I’ve seen news stories which seem to back up your point of view. Many who voted for it are now regretting it. I know of some people who voted for it not because they supported it, but as a protest against the current government and they are hugely sorry now. Hopefully with the results of the last election and with the polls, the split will never happen.
Yes, maybe. Time will tell.
Thank God you’re here to tell us every economist in the country is wrong and that you know better.
“every economist in the country” lmao. Anyone making a claim like that has no opinion of value
Yes, it was an exaggeration, obviously. It’s called “hyperbole”. The fact remains that over 95% of economists, i.e. people who actually know what they’re talking about, are opposed to brexit. Pretending you know better is nothing more than verbal masturbation.
God knows why anyone thought it was a good idea to have a referendum in the first place. Handing a decision like that over to the people last qualified to form a rational opinion on the matter is like giving a hand grenade to a monkey and trusting it to be sufficiently well-informed and intelligent to refrain from pulling out the pin.
Maybe the outcome would have been different had the leave voters been prepared to confess their real reason for doing so, given that none of their stated reasons stand up to scrutiny.
DD, are those the same economists who told us that not joining the Euro would be a disaster for Sterling, and the that Euro would be the world’s leading currency within ten years? Remind us how that panned out. Don’t forget to include Greece in your assessment.
Only fools think economics is a science. Modern economics is more about politics than anything else.
There are concerns that the Greeks will ruin the Euro. The country is catastrophically corrupt. But it is a nice holiday destination, though. It just shouldn’t be in the EU.
It is such a small part of the whole that the country can be carried if absolutely necessary.
Economists were invented to make weathermen look good. (That’s actually an industry joke)
Both hilarious and hilariously ill-informed. Care to cite your source for the “every economist in the country” supporting Brexit?
(For the record, I’m an economist, and very much not a Brexiteer)
Unfortunately, DD, he ( Joe ) is almost certainly right about UK leaving EU.
‘Throwing the baby out with the bathwater’ comes to mind when it comes to Brexiteer logic ! Never a good solution to any problem, simply walking away .
Oh there are some massive problems with the EU, no doubt about that.
But you crack the big issues from inside the talking shop, not from the street
outside, where the noisy traffic of world commerce tends to make your voice
completely inaudible. Totally ignored.
> every economist in the country
Seriously? Is supporting Brexit?
You’re literally delusional. The whole campaign slogan for Brexit was ‘the country’s had enough of experts’. Because something like 90% of economists said Brexit was economic self harm.
To be fair, though, Patrick Minford came out for Brexit and it was all over the front pages. For some reason no-one bothered reporting his call for government help for manufacturing workers, because he said that more or less the entire UK manufacturing sector would be driven out of business, including virtually all of the British motor industry. And this guy was by far the most respected economist arguing -in favour- of Brexit. With friends like that…
Sorry, I’m being completely clueless. I misunderstood which way you were arguing. As you were, just ignore me. Duh…
You are entitled to your opinion… even if it is wholly inaccurate!
wholly inaccurate? Interesting considering you have no way to prove me wrong. Just other peoples opinions and conjecture. Without getting too specific I am heavily involved in global commodity trade and I can tell you that the UK is being watched very closely. We all expect them to the smart (and right) thing in terms of taxes, regulations, and such which will have the likes of us rushing into their open arms. As long as the UK is smart, sticks to their guns and does bend to the whims of the EU negotiators (the UK has tons of leverage that the EU and many in the media refuse to admit) they will become a hub of many industries. Especially since many are looking for any reasonable out from under the heavy handed colossus that is the EU. There is a reason the EU section has had absolutely terrible growth for nearly a decade and some of the lowest growth in the entire world during that time…and it is not getting better nor will it get better any time soon. Even the IMF recently had to admit the UK is likely to outgrow the EU over the next 12 months — and that is WITHOUT a finalized brexit package. Free of stagnate EU the UK has ample room and potential for growth..and knowing the british they will make sure it happens.
The claims of self important and arrogant economists that are more interested in making sure their pre-brexit claims become true than adjusting their opinions to fit reality don’t matter much to me. I will focus on the actual money, and the money is loving what potential a EU-free UK brings
Sorry to say so James, but to me it seems you are in your bubble of fellow global commodity traders and fail to see outside of it.
I can see how it makes global commodity trade easier if the UK is not in any block – because it would be hard to implement any taxes and the UK would likely have to accept the lowest common denominator for quality / health&safety / consumer protection, because they would have no other option left if out of the EU markets.
Yes, it will make some people quite rich, at least short term. But it will clearly have a huge negative impact on most other things.
From Financial institutions looking at ways out of London, disruption of Airlines ‘ business, lack of workers, unclarity over standards/rules hurting manufacturing, obstruction to international travel/transport to the biggest and closest markets, disputes over who cought what fish where, rising discrimination and hate crimes, none of it is positive at all.
And I don’t know what IMF reports you are reading, but the last ones I saw actual made downwards adjustments for the UK.
Since your government does not seem to even be able to have a clear plan of how to approach it, I think we will all be glad to breathe in, when in about a year and a half from now (or maybe after an extension of the negotiation period is granted, to make more people forget about the tedious process), the whole idea gets silently buried (or enacted in name only with the reality being that nothing much changed, if that helps save political face a bit).
The OECD published forecast in June of this year suggested 1.75% growth for the EU in both 2017 and 2018. Comparative data for the UK, using the same methodology, suggested 1.6% for 2017 and 1% for 2018.
If you want to look at IMF data, then the research published three days ago suggests that 2017 GDP growth will be almost identical in EU and UK (1.98% EU vs 2.05% UK), but that the EU will grow faster in 2018 and 2019.
To claim that economists are “arrogant” and to then make a number of sweeping assertions claims based on their data (which you distrust) suggests that you’ve been to the Donald Trump School Of Logic.
Yeah yeah yeah any news media article which points out a number of reasons why you’re talking bollocks is just “media lies” and “fake news”. Heard that before somewhere…
Bollocktics
Spot on.
Everyone entitled to their own opinion, but these “experts” don’t live in the real world, much like the FIA.
The silence is deafening… Best to keep an open mind and listen to both sides of the debate.
Extraordinary deduction ! Quite the most disastrous decision the UK has made in 100 years. We drift inexorably into a chasm like the desperate days leading up to WW1.
Spot on james. I never fail to be amazed at those who, post referendum, consistently back the EU over their own country’s future success and prosperity. Countless commentators would rather see Britain fail than Brexit succeed. And no, “Britain will be worse off” doesn’t cut it – all should get behind our country and unite to make Brexit a success.
Yeah, right… my country took my vote away.
and much of my pension !
Agreed! Truly astonishing how many people would like to see this go bad just so they can say “I told you so”.
really interesting note book. The fact that Nicolas Todt is also co-owner of ART GP with Fred Vasseur means that the two of them have really good relationships and it could be an advantage regarding Ferrari engine deal and the arrival of Charles Leclerc in one seat next year. The second one could remain Werhlein, thanks to good business deal with Toto Wolff. In terms of engineer, Guillaume Cappietto could also switch from Prema to Sauber as he has good connections with Vasseur and Todt jr.
For Mc Laren, things are very difficult to guess for 2018 but very interesting rumors from your side.
Brilliant just like reading a good book, thank you Joe ..
On the basis that 2 + 2 doesn’t always equal 4. I’ll still ask the question. Since McLaren have added BMW to their engine building partnership with Ricardo. Would it be too much of a stretch to think that BMW would be involved in your suggested McLaren F1 engine.
“A Japan-EU trade deal is deemed to be a threat”……
Oh that is small frites. When you have time, check out the China inspired ‘One belt one road’ initiative. There is only one winner, and that is China. But the EU is blindly supporting it, along with other world leaders. Sometimes you can fool all of the people all of the time!
The BMW deal is joint R&D
I’ve been properly frightened by the prospect of Brexit. Not merely the harsh reality we’ll have to face. But the intensely socially undermining effect of the breakdown of many layers of cognitive dissonance both natural and foisted upon the people by government desperation. A humiliation is inevitable. Is this why we had emergency powers in place so long as 13 years and 5 months ago… And I am thoroughly and fundamentally raised in the belief in our good systems we trust, yet I am in abject fear of the disintegration of that now tentative trust. I recently drafted a position paper on the subject of securing communications for the masses, and concluded that both British and American interests are closely intertwined with the need for a sense of stable privacy, here painfully undermined by the warrantless provision of the RIPA statutes.
Well John we are not divorcing from the USA, in fact we will probably be doing a great deal more business with them after Brexit. That this is likely is evidenced by the hissy fits of the Germans every time we mention trade talks.(you are not allowed to talk to anyone until we have finished draining you of every penny!)
Rest assured all communications are filtered and evaluated by Echelon and/or Prism. You will be aware of the enforced back doors (admitted or not) built into all US originated systems including W10 Google etc. Also you will know of the attempts to get a quantum computer working on cracking RSA as routine. The yanks really hate it when they cannot hack something and GCHQ have very strong ties to NSA.
If you develop your unbreakable communication method you will be coerced into back dooring it. However, best of luck old chap.
> I’ve been properly frightened by the prospect of Brexit.
That’s because you’re paying attention. If you’re not frightened, you’re not listening. Good work.
I have a feeling the halo will be with us for a year or two, then (hopefully) disappear. This ruling sets a very real and scary precedent for F1 if its not handled well.
As for Swiss cheese, many either choose to take it, or leave it. Personally, I can’t be far enough away from it. The stuff from the west (French) is ok but the strong Appenzeller(east-
where I live) cheese is an assault to the senses.
Swiss wine, however, is not too bad.
And to you, Joe, very happy to hear you’ve squeezed in time for your domestic summer chores- even before your summer break. Let’s face it- those paddling pools don’t blow themselves up.
> if all goes well, [Auer] could replace Perez in 2018 if he gets a superlicence.
But, Joe, even winning the DTM championship is not going to get Auer enough points to earn his superlicence, and neither is anything else he’s doing or done. What are you suggesting?
I still dream of a extra session before qualifying, for the exhibition of development and new coming drivers. Maybe such a session would be a opportunity for Auer and others.
sadly you’d need third cars for that.
The third driver during free practice sessions back in circa 2004 enabled this. Shame they don’t consider bringing this back.
Hi Joe,
What team do you see Wehrlein driving for next year? I assume it cannot be Williams, due to Martini’s over 25 ‘rule’?
Thanks.
Yeah well above and beyond all the engine , team sales and internal shake up rumors the worst news of the day by far is the fact that the idiots running F1 have chosen to go with that hideous ‘ Halo ‘ system that looks like an abomination from the bowls of hell added on to what are already overly complex glommed up cars aesthetically … but also blocks a good 35-40% of the drivers vision . And having raced cars in the past with a 180 degree peripheral vision let me tell you …. every bit of that vision counts when it comes to passing , avoiding accidents etc .Brilliant . Once again common sense being ‘ trumped ‘ by revisionist reality in the name of who knows what .
Sigh .. I’m telling you Joe … the future for F1 … isn’t looking very bright at all …. so take off the shades and lets have ourselves a good cry … sniff …
Did you actually read the column?
I am only looking without serious purpose, but it seems that every road car I have read reviews of is endowed by far less than the visibility I want to accept. At least among the ones I only read reviews of, but the trend seems to affect quite ostensibly sensible autos too. Just anecdotal and quite impressionistic, but I worry about it being a trend. Sarcastically, is F1 imitating road rockets and sadly far from supercar design too?
Admit it…..you’re Christian Sylt.
You window dress your messages, but theres a common theme.
That’s very funny.
What’s the common theme? That Liberty don’t know what they’re doing, because they are no longer guided by the true source of ultimate wisdom?
Look through his previous comments. This is a diet version.
Roger Federer was rightly the big news on Sunday, even for this F1 fan (who also loves tennis). He’s always been a class act and is rightly admired all over the world. Having said that, I did watch the race live from start to finish. Lewis was brilliant all weekend and I’m sure his (genuine) fans will forgive him missing that quaint little sideshow in the capital and doing his talking where it matters most. Loved Verstappen’s refusal to be ‘bullied’ and found the Ferrari woes at the end really heart-warming. Top stuff.
+1 Excellent points
McLaren going to Renault PU makes some sense in that they will also be working with BP fuel, and with Fuel becoming such an important element these days in overall performance that has to be a good thing. Same is not true of course for STR and RBR.
Joe, on that point, is there any word in the pit lane about how well ExxonMobil are doing vs BP in the Renault engine?
And re. your comment about contracts – if RBR & RenaultSport haven’t got a proper contract, but RBR are getting their engines each race, do Renault have any guarantee they’ll actually be paid??
Doesn’t really answer your question, but maybe you can infer something from this following quote. BP shopping around lines up with what Joe said on the blog this time last year.
‘BP/Castrol didn’t get into F1 until very late in the season (and at all recently), when it was assured that Bernie left. Bernie and BP have bad blood which I won’t go into here.
Anyway, that meant a pretty hectic scramble for R&D, resources, set up, training and the like, but it is spring boarded off the back of the new Ultimate formulation, which was a big step for BP anyway. But even at the time of pre-season testing, the whole set up was not well developed.
Long story short, BP was shopping around for a ‘primary’ customer team for a while. Renault was in talks first, with McLaren second. From what I can say, as it currently stands BP has not put anywhere near the same amount of effort into F1 this season that Exxon, Shell or Petronas has, but supposedly the actual tech is superior.
I would be more surprised to find out that BP were actually at Barcelona testing than not! BP/Castrol crew is very small and woefully unprepared’.
Seems like a pretty good answer to me, thank you.
Interestingly, apparently Renault were only using Castrol from the Spanish GP. ‘Fuel drums were hand delivered by a senior team member in their car to get them on track in time’.
To me, the big question about a halo is whether it will reduce injuries and deaths. Dead drivers are far uglier than the halo. Former baseball player turned broadcaster Joe Garagiola used to say that when his team started wearing batting helmets in the 1950s, old timers like Frankie Frisch would ridicule them as “inverted garbage cans”. Today no one from the majors to little league would dare bat without wearing a helmet..
I see no value in the comparison.
OK lets try the line that seat belts are for wimps and are dangerous a) because they slow down the drivers escape from a burning car and b) because its better to be thrown away from a car full of petrol than be strapped to it…. :), dam safety inventions will never catch on (just teasing)
On a different note it looks like we are going to be in for lots of Intrigue with new manufacturer’s entering the sport Cosworth, porche/Audi & McLaren its going to be a busy time for you in the next few years, i look forward to reading about it in GP+
ps it shows how hard the times are for Sauber if their drivers are showing at Migros and not Globis or Pfister
These are exactly the arguments put forward, seriously, when belts were first made a requirement.
The only significant research up to then was completed by Volvo. In very brief, and from memory, they found that the slowest speed fatality without belts occurred at 6mph and with at 28mph. Absolutely it was better to stay in the car than to be ejected. The exception, of course, was Hans Hermann’s BRM at Avus (right man right venue ?) and I believe Masten Gregory did something similar.
Any crash at the time, when fuel pumps were largely mechanical, leading to a fire would have almost certainly been fatal. It is only Hollywood that has every crash leading to an explosion.
This reminds me of Dale Earnhardt Sr who would not use the newly launched Hans device. If my memory is correct, he thought it would “hang him” in the event of a large impact. Later studies showed that the movement of his head at impact (10 to 20 degrees, not sure…) was exactly what the Hans device was designed for. Apparently, this sort angle at impact is when the neck is at its most vulnerable.
The road to halo is paved with good intentions …
halo will only be around until a driver is stuck upside down and cant get out off the car. Just when the sport is sorting its crap out, great racing and cool looking cars. We get this.
I wonder how quickly F1’s latest ugly protrusion would disappear were a disembodied tyre to bounce off the halo of a following car, arguably saving the driver’s life, but be ricocheted 200 feet in the air and return to earth in the same place as an unfortunate spectator.
As the ticket says…
But I fear as does Joe, that the game is over, if we add “(but not for drivers)”
Wow, Joe you sure feel strongly about the halo! Personally I don’t have a problem with it at all, I wouldnt describe it as “ugly” when fitted to the currant F1 cars which aren’t exactly beautifull. Sure, it would deffinately look out of place on Jim Clark’s Lotus or Stirling’s 250F !
The screen’s deffinately out. If you’ve ever been in a race in a car with a dirty screen, especially when the sun is low in the sky, you’d know the “screen” is totally impractical on an F1 car.
But on the other side of the coin you’ve once again delivered an amazing column, thanks a million.
PK.
Cannot there be sufficient airflow coopted to protect a screen from the pebble dash of insects and detritus?
That would be hard to do @john (other John) with tech we have – speeds are probably not high enough (as in jet fighter high), and a lot of what sticks in F1 would be sticky rubber chunks mixed with a bit of oil/fuel and dirt from the track.
Add water to that, and it gets a nice smear. I don’t think any currently available coating or spray, nor tear offs would be sufficient or practical (“Seb, pit now to have your screen wiped” would be awkward).
That said, I am sure that the combined brain power and resources available in F1 should be able to solve the issue, if they set themselves to it. Maybe FOM having their own tech staff will help fuel that – afterall, the promotor will be the first to want to find something better looking.
Who knows, maybe the FIA mandating the Halo now actually helps fuel a frantic effort to come up with something better relatively short term.
Ever driven an open wheel car John? There’s a reason for visor tear offs.
Look at photos from the 50s and 60s notably of Stirling Moss.
Trouble is that the airflow that hits the screen is usually carrying the said pebble dash.
yeah, for ’18:
Mclaren + Renault + Alonso + Kubica -» makes all sense!
Toro Rosso + Honda -» not worst than it is today, so it is very plausible…
and the surprise:
Red Bull + Honda -» also makes total sense, both for Honda, who gets a strong technical partner (kers, simulation, etc), also for RBR, they will became a “factory team” and when the “engine” is a winner – and it will be – they will not need to share it with rival teams.
I’ve wet eyes on reading your desire for Robert paired which Fernando. I’m thinking no more else I’ll be too emotional completely. What a delightful combination that would be. Just now you implanted me with the first and only fantasy F1 team I will dream of forever.
I think that was the aim of Ferrari for 2012 or 2013. Talk of Kubica having a pre-contract to replace Massa surfaced after the accident.
But not until after his management promised Renault he’d be OK and tried to get them to sign his contract. Because by that point Ferrari had moved on.
/I’ve wet eyes on reading your desire for Robert paired which Fernando/
I’ve wet eyes after Renault announced Robert taking part in Hungaroring test.
/Mclaren + Renault + Alonso + Kubica -» makes all sense!/
Why would Renault go for this… ah, they might sign Perez! 😉
Still, what would Stoffel do in such case?
He might be living in the real world…
Well, I figure I’ll go on record on supporting the halo, albeit somewhat indirectly. I could not care less what the cars look like….they could look like nissan minivans and have five foot thick foam bumpers all around them, so long as they can still take corners at 5G and do 300kph. That would be a sight!
GO THE HALO!!! : )
Significant Notebook, there, Joe!
I’m in for a second reading to appreciate the depth and breadth of your notes. There’s more to it than I see many websites updating in a week.
While the bulk by numbers of people who are variously “covering” F1, barely manage to find the least embarrassing vanity, you’re drawing from a ever wider range of different thoughts and wider circles and broader churches to explore the possibilities of different influences and patterns of focus, and I am finding your notebooks increasingly interesting as a long range forecast is to a farmer, if every other may have a barometer, you’ve the lore from Saint Swithins, to Medard, Urban du Langres, through Siebenschläfertag to Rayleigh scatter maps. May only the rain at Spa elude your gaze!
On the worrying side of things, and I feel the portent of your mental forecasts tingling, this Halo device is very much the kind of thing that I would like to see dealt with by the sport at a separate level, and to my idea of a F1 Industry Group, I feel that arguments are accumulating, because of the need to work political factors out of engineering decisions in ever shorter order, as the economy tightens towards more races wanted by Liberty, and if not precarious then delicate balances at every row on the grid.
I would like to see a initiative to investigate the issues that apply to incentives to bring another team, or material engineering concern, towards Hinwil. It is a idea I thoroughly expect to be ridiculed, but I hasten to suggest that the timetable for this year is beyond the power of many to greatly affect within the teams, and so one must have a vision of the coming decades, and speak seriously with the local state and government to discuss their own desires. If any plans are to be considered, it is too early to say with precision what is the result of hurried intent, we have to deal with general interests and think broadly in earnest what the possible future concerns may look like. Sauber is a prestigious attraction that may be a premise for attracting real interest in long term plans, if you identify qualities that will persist you can build up with others. I am far from qualified to assess the level of value for my idea, but I am adamant it’s in the sport’s interest to know what the possibilities are. I’m perplexed and I am not alone in this position, as to what Sauber is without its unique element, but I always felt that it was a strength and not weakness. Specifically, showing genuine interest in and regard for their unique position may be invaluable to instil confidence that’s invaluable for the future of the sport too. If the will existed from within a non political level of F1, the will may very well be found in abundance in the political world in Switzerland, and the ensuing exploration by no means necessary will be fanciful. I think it’s important to protect what to my mind is a significant outpost and blazon of F1’s very best values. Ultimately the sport is needing the sense of being able to develop the community beyond its traditional boundaries and not alienate potential new teams, who ideally will be looking to develop teams in new locations. I only hope that some kind of determined forward looking projections will become a part of the daily business of F1.
Dear John John, I really enjoy reading your contributions but for the life of me can’t think why. I comprehend the gist but rarely the detail of what you say which wizzes over my intellectually inadequate head. To assist me a little please would you put an in front of vowels, each time I hit one it stops me in my tracks. Yours affectionately. RP ( no I just yet )
Hi Richards, sorry for the late POOR service dear friend, I have been thoroughly in a scrap with the subtle influence of my phone’s spell checking word prompt. This became acute due to the new Skype app, which I have to have running for family reasons, becoming a resource denial of service and creating double digital seconds delays to screen appearance of individual letters. The rest is probably the constant imbalance of the smorgasbord of painkillers that none of them work but I sure suffer without. I don’t readily. realise the pernicious interference and for entirely unrelated reasons am fighting for the right of use of my thoughts lately swamped by vast swathes of memories of life I’ve no recollection of living. I shall decide on a new laptop, but I’m prone much of the day and silenced often by the damn relentlessness of it all, often as not. So I am battling to simply coordinate what I know I’m thinking but is being buried frenetically by all manner of nuisances that quickly a 2 and 2 make 55 tormenting me by robbing clarity, then the damn spelling checks trash the every littlest bit of my phrasing. I need a voice dictation application that interprets screaming rage! 😂 definitely working on it however!
That’s the most articulate and moving description of what it’s like to battle a serious medical or neurological condition I’ve ever been priviledged to hear. Good luck, J other J.
Now I feel small. I shall continue to read and enjoy your contributions.
Best.
On if my friends has good results with ‘Dragon naturally speaking’ fpor dictation if that is any help.
Good luck for the next 10-12 days Joe. Safe travels, and hopefully once that time has passed you get yourself a little break.
Self appointed spokesman for the masses here, but your insight and delivery of the sport is cherished, appreciated and one of a kind.
Hi Joe,
Any chance that the HALO will get binned if there is sufficient fan outrage?
I was also wondering if it will also apply for the junior classes?
No
I couldn’t find a former [or current] driver or long time journalists or pundits who have endorsed the halo. Is Jean Napoleon really out of his mind? I already miss heavily Mosley.
It looks simply hideous and ridiculous. My being a F-1 fan for such long time may be the final proof i’m a masochist and won’t recognize it.
Joe,
Thanks as always, been looking forward to teh green book.
is there anyway that the halo can be manipulated to add Aero advantage’ to the car? Is it presecribed for specific dimensions or to a set of strength tests that has to be adhered to.. or are they manufacturered for the teams who just have to fit them?
I would guess the latter but it might be interesting if the need for head protection became part of the ‘tub’ specification giving the teams something they can work with and presenting ‘head safety’ within the spirit of F1 allowing the teams to have to include it in their designs against a specific strength, access or possible crush test specification. I know more money but greater acceptence would be achieved.
Considering the Halo issue, I think Mr. Todt wants to promote his brainchild Formula E in any way, to bring more manufacturers in.It´s a joke, that no one of the big teams says no, we will not run it. Liberty should oppone the strongest, because FIA begins to kill Formal 1 in favor of the bloody Formula E crap. Next step, unmanned Formula E cars going round in circels. Guess what, the winners will be Renault, Mercedes, Audi or either. Showing of their ingenious capacities in the purest way. No driver puppest, as di Grassi or Buemi needed. The glory goes to the brand in full. So sometimes i wished Bernie comes back to show all this Formula 1 kindergarden genuines, which way to go is the best.
Ive always thought it a natural progression for McLaren to make their own engines, and assuming the 2021 rules will simplify the engine rules, it will be the perfect time to start. Interim supply from Renault the next few years then?
Hi Joe, are they looking at doing something about the current penalty system for component replacements? As always, thanks for the blogs.
Not that I’ve heard
Given the number of nasty accidents involving head injuries, I understand why the FIA had a look at devices like the halo. What does the introduction in 2018 in F1 actually mean? Is it a trial or intended as a permanent measure? Which other single seater classes will get halos? Has anyone evaluated whether the halo is appropriate for production racing cars?
Any risk assessment of four wheel racing would conclude that the biggest risk comes from flying cars. It is not the most common risk but it is the one with the greatest potential impact. A flying car accident at Le Mans 1955 — a genuine tragedy — ended circuit racing in Switzerland and disrupted racing elsewhere in Europe. In more recent years we’ve seen flying cars in F1, Indy racing, historic racing where spectator deaths were narrowly missed. Any incident involving passive race attendees poses a greater threat to the sport than one involving drivers.
I conclude that the FIA are well meaning but disconnected from safety measures which really matter.
***
Re motorcycle road racing, a sport for the truly brave. Top circuit bike riders learn how quickly a bike can brake and corner (100%) and try to race consistently at that level (98 or 99% allowing for human fallibility). 101%+ is usually not disastrous owing to run off areas at modern circuits. Top road racers aren’t daft; few at any level are fatalistic. They ride at 95% to maximise the odds of correcting an error.
Your third paragraph really nailed it Phil!
The halo is a disastrous decision. Highly questionable benefits outweighed by highly probable direct disadvantages, And then there are the looks ! Heath Robinson would have been proud.
The Halo is the result of bad politics, the FIA committed themselves to “A” safety device by a date and having been seen to be weak lately, this demonstrates that they value power above reason. All it does is shifts the danger another step onwards.
Instead they could change some rules about recovery vehicles being allowed on the track-side areas. The current rules allow cars to unlap themselves behind the safety car this often seems to happen at full speed while crashed vehicles are being recovered, obviously ludicrous. The virtual safety car system is far safer as all cars must slow down and maintain position, no unlapping, no tail enders dashing to catch up the pack. No dashing round after a pit stop during safety car the out lap should be speed controlled to safety car pace.
I will take the Halo if they get rid of the chicanes at Monza. Perfectly safe, No?
Hi Joe,
Great work Joe as ever – really enjoying your insight on Sauber at the moment.
Just a quick question will the Halo, also be on F2 and F3 cars? or have the FIA not decided on the junior formula’s yet?
Thanks in advance
Kris
No idea
Just to pick up on Joe’s “conservatives slitting each other’s throats” he could take a look at the opposition, which has fallen into disarray with rampant communism claiming it won the election, (Apparently it now seems, achieved by many students voting twice) vs old labour, vs the terrible spectre of the undead multi millionaire Blair creature, who, though some think he clearly should be in prison, wants to stay in the EU with himself as president, dictator, king, maybe god, or all three.
Meanwhile M Macron the self proclaimed new sun god, is leading France into trouble.
It is not often noted that Germany is governed by a coalition with the direct opposition, as Merkel and co have less of a majority than Mrs May!
I wonder how much the BBC’s blatant anti Brexit stance comes across in France it is mentioned almost every day here.
While we are in “interesting times” as the Chinese would say, we have the opportunity to bet upon who Mr Gove will upset next, he has done really well at it so far!
All British politicians are rubbish. There’s the whole centre waiting to be grabbed.
All politicians are rubbish. That includes America, Germany, Italy, Turkey Russia and Greece.
Joe – whilst I understand the reasoning behind the FIA decision i.e. the Strategy Group’s decision last year – is there any chance do you think that it might be used as a bargaining chip against some other (slightly less stupid) FIA idea?
No
Do you think F1 teams could boycott the Halo next season ?
They could say, we are sorry but we will never put that on our cars…
Could the drivers say the same, sorry we will never drive with such an absurd system over our head.?
The FIA is crazy introducing this thing. I hope Todt will not be reelected…
Unfortunately if it is in the regs, the scrutineers will exclude any car in “A dangerous condition” which will be the situation without a (supposed) major safety device.
Joe, what’s your take on buemi and vergne as drivers? And who was the most talented driver not to make it in F1 in the last 10 years. And one more question if I may, how quick was Warwick?
I mean derek, but whilst I clarify my question, would Paul Warwick have made it?
Derek was a good pedaller. The lost talented not to make it? Define talent… Liuzzi probably. Wasted by Red Bull.
Delboy was at least as good as Mansell?
Top talents that didn’t make it to F1 are aplenty whether it was budgetary issues, accidents, face not fitting, alleged attitude problems..
The massive standout not to make it in recent years has to be Robin Frijns. He really is very good indeed but has been overtaken by the Max furore. Massively quick pedaller.
My list of those who were top drawer who never got a F1 career their talents deserved in my lifetime in no particular order are:
Mike Thackwell
Stefano Modena
Alex Zanardi
Stefan Bellof
Tom Kristensen
Allan McNish
Bert Fabi
Thomas Danielsson
Rickard Rydell
Martin Donnelly
Greg Moore
Gonzalo Rodriguez
Jason Watt
Fabrizio Barbaza
Marco Apicella
Esteban Guerrieri
Helio Castroneves
Chris van der drift
Etiene van der linde
Richard Westbrook
He certainly was in the mid-80s I reckon. I wonder how he would have done at Lotus in 1986..
Not sure why Bellof is on the list. Isn’t his a loss of a different kind?
He was a great in the making, and had visibly defeated Brundle by a decent margin. And yet Brundle went on to have a very solid F1 career.
Surely the F1 paddock had taken note of Bellof? Wouldn’t he have been nailed on for a move up the grid in short order if he’d lived?
I don’t recall Bellof hammering Brundle? Monaco aside Martin had often outqualified and outraced him.
Bellof was out of the same mould as Gilles (also Brundle’s hero?) so I do
wonder how far he ultimately would have got super quick as he was.
Not my recollection, but I don’t have data to hand (& because the team was disqualified, I’m not sure where I’d get it).
What I do recall is that pre-season, Ken made rather strong comparisons for Brundle (with Stewart?) to get the sponsors interested. And had to walk them back into a description of driving *style* not ability after Bellof…well, in my memory, had the upper hand pretty clearly, but, etc. So ‘Brundle is as quick as Stewart’ got retconned as ‘Brundle drives *like* Stewart, whereas Bellof doesn’t drive like Stewart, he drives more like…*Jim Clark*’ (!) if memory serves.
Liuzi wasn’t as fast as Vetel or Riciardo or Verstapen so they dropped him. It’s a shame.
I was asked my opinion. I gave it.
Joe thanks for the comment to my comment on that, it’s really interesting to hear, I remember liuzzi having to share his drive for some reason (maybe it was with Klien) and he did have an impressive F3000 record. He always seemed a good fit for redbull, so shame they didn’t use his talent. Perhaps he didn’t get on with Helmut Marko? Would love to hear your opinion on him as a organiser and discoverer of talent.
He has a good eye, but he is brutal
Robin Frijns and Felix Rosenqvist
“Most players and spectators accept this risk.”
Apparently the GPA are still looking to further reduce risk and endorsed the halo.
Any thoughts on the GPA endorsement???
Can they do otherwise?
Yes they can. If they really care about the sport and it’s appeal then they should express their opinion. The HALO is a horrifying idea that has no place.
It really illuminates the appeal of MotoGp. People like the danger motorsports bring.
Regards,
Steve
I was talking about liability.
Yes it’s all about the insurance. Question is from whom for what ?
Over very many years it has always seemed to me that those with real talent at the top level are found no matter what they drive. There have been numerous cases of hugely talented achievers in the lower levels just not making the grade when promoted. It seems to me that Ocon, of the present ingenues, is the one to watch.
Perez is faster than Ocon. Ocon is good but not top level like Vetel, Hamilton, Alonso or Raikonen.
Really? Which finished ahead last week?
Last Week? Ocon. But if you look at all the races that both drivers finished this season it is 7 to 1 in favour of Perez. Pretty convincing.
Have you not watched the trend? Nor considered the fact that Ocon had never been to most of the circuits?
I don’t think we should be rubbishing Perez in his battle with Ocon? Checo stacked up well against Button and then Hulk. Ocon may turn out to to be the best Frenchman since Prost
I’m not rubbishing Perez, I am saying that your analysis could go a little deeper
It’s clear so far this season that Ocon has grown to match the pace and appears to be overtaking Checo. Will he be regularly ahead by the end of the season? Possibly but what does tell us is that Ocon is clearly a great talent because Perez is no mug. Will Perez be able to respond?
And neither is Perez, despite all the years of experience he has over Ocon. Duh….
Joe, thanks on amazing insiders informativna. Do you think there is any chance that we donts see HALO next year?
Sadly not
Bit of out there thinking. The Concorde agreement is up in a few years – whats stopping some cashed up Arab (for example) dangling a carrot in front of teams and getting them to partake in a new series from 2020/21 onwards?
It could be an easy way to bring in some form of budget cap, which will attract new entries, as the alternative for the existing teams is to race with a halo, which is going to be a big detriment to the sport.
Call me a conspiracy theorist, but part of me thinks this is part of some big plan, given historical relationships in the sport. Who did the current FIA President used to be employed by, who has been given financial benefits greater than other teams, which team voted for the halo? If we get some form of comment from Max Mosley in the coming days supporting the halo I think something is going on behind the scenes, with the big loser, in the long term, being Liberty.
Yes!
And Yes!
Arab dude with bankroll could go a long way down the road of creating a very interesting alternative series.
Oh, definitely there is a long term plan that will unroll in due course, and I am certain that Liberty will double take the situation.
But the world championship is not going anywhere soon.
And Liberty can handle themselves, despite I think they are in for some surprises, without a doubt. It’s been all too smooth and yet their patience with deciding what to advance, suggests to me that they never could do the kind of due diligence that would unearth the machinations of Dear Bernie.
Nonetheless I believe that a truly realistic approach to the situation, funded with a cold assessment of the enormous expense, actually could stand a chance to break the sport by attacking the FIA behaviour of the Todt and late Max regime. Todt in particular. With the adequate roll, the behaviour is far from inscrutable and to my mind contemptuous.
I like the way you’re pointing…
For some reason, since day one I’ve thought the transition from the Bernie reign went way too smooth. Part of me thinks it is not over yet.
The halo, the British Grand Prix break clause, a sold out Belgian Grand Prix operating at a loss. I’m sure there are days where Liberty wonder what on earth they have got themselves into.
I watch with great interest, and a great degree of caution. Hows that EU Commission investigation going?
A dong on the nose, a G-string in the middle, all that’s needed is big ol’ tiddies on the back. Now that’s what I call a hybrid.
Joe, if a driver should have a rollover accident and stop inverted, as happened to Fernando last year in Melbourne, can he extract himself with the halo in place? Is he supposed to wait calmly for the Marshals?
/can he extract himself with the halo in place?/
I’ve read that FIA had conducted such test with its operative and there had been no problem with him getting out.
Buy explosive bolts from any of the aeronautical suppliers.
The last time I looked for a supply, the manufacturer could boast of zero failures, failure including not releasing within the specifications.
My application was very boring : emergency exit from a patio window that was redesigned to take polymer film reinforcing, which was great for ingress protection, but would also trap the occupant. Hence explosive bolts were added to release the frame upon trigger from the panic alarm system. (required fresh trigger and proximity. The alternatives were not suitable for use in a genuine panic situation.)
You must come back home with P&O more often Joe.The fresh sea air has helped produce the best notebook of the season, and generated the most wide ranging, interesting and even informative response from your readers.
Wonderful stuff, keep up the good work. Thankyou.
Joe – from the Formula 1 website – “…the driver must be able to get out within five seconds without having to remove anything except seatbelts and steering wheel (which he must be able to refit within another five seconds).”
Do you know if this is actually tested – each driver with their indivdual car?
Fantastic blog as always Joe- thank you!
Having been thoroughly convinced by your: “Let’s be sensible about Honda” piece a few months ago it’s been hard adjusting to a possible new reality!
Is Honda + $100m + $15m (1/2 FA salary) not greater than coming 3rd/4th in the table with Renault?
Also, I realise that Renault aren’t the ‘old enemy’ in the sense that Ferrari are but are they really going to go with engines from such a long-standing competitor? It seems to leave a bad taste in the mouth to go cap in hand to someone we’ve been battling for decades!
A temporary suspension of the Honda deal, whilst they sort themselves out, would make sense I guess? Although without an alternative team to run engines with, I don’t see how Honda will improve.
Cheers!
Regards to the Halo and F1. Why does it have to be more safe? What is it with all this risk aversion and PC nonsense about a safety conscious world? Is anyone suggesting putting spikes on the sides of the wheels like some sort of cartoon?
No one is actively suggesting that there be death or injury but life is risky, everyday life is full of examples where adults take calculated risks and get a reward for doing so, some do more so than others and some activities are more risky than others, does this make it wrong? No absolutely not.
There are certain pastimes and human pursuits that are risky and even dare i say it dangerous! Motor racing is one of them….in case everybody forgot. So is horse riding, parachuting and surfing. Should we advocate all of these activities have similar protective measures put in place, should they be outlawed instead because they’re too dangerous or should we perhaps just let full grown, intelligent adults make their own risk assessments about their actions?
This is a clear case of the FIA getting scared out of their wits by a law suit and insurance companies.
Yeah Daryl, and one of the MOST dangerous is down hill trailbike riding, I’m told one of the special advanced tracks here in Christchutch hurts 1 in 7 riders requiring hospital treatment, and aparently EVERY rider WILL get hurt sooner or later! And we shouldn’t forget Motorcross either!
PK.
I used to race motocross!
Been trying to figure out what I really think about the halo (instinctive reaction is NO!), then decided that if better protection is really required, I would much rather see a fully enclosed cockpit. Might just as well make it a bit safer by enclosing the wheels at the same time. And keep the hybrid. Oh, wait …